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#448577 - 13/05/17 10:09 AM Re: Jaguar Classics: E-type rebuilds at a price! [Re: Aeroman]
Chester.G Offline
Learner Plates Off!

Registered: 31/08/16
Posts: 353
Loc: Cork
at least it's better they rebuild than they finish like this work



Edited by Chester.G (13/05/17 10:12 AM)

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#448604 - 13/05/17 01:10 PM Re: Jaguar Classics: E-type rebuilds at a price! [Re: howard]
lowebird Offline
Talk Morgan Expert

Registered: 11/01/11
Posts: 2918
Loc: norfolk, UK
Originally Posted By howard
Originally Posted By Jays
I'd love to see them being built too!

I wonder how their search for cars to rebuild will affect prices?


Not much. I cant see them selling more than a handful at that price level and there are lots of E types around. There were 4 of them at my recent classic car meet out of a total of maybe 20 cars in all. And talking to the restorers of these cars, they indicated a cost of 50 to 100k to do the restoration all to an excellent standard.

Cant help but feel that this initiative is just another indication of the classic car bubble reaching its peak. The collectables cycle has happened before and will happen again as the economy begins to cool down, house prices weaken and interest rates start to improve.


IMHO, having owned and sold a beautiful S1 o.t.s. E type, you can never see enough E types, for me even as a rabid Ferrari fan, the E is still the most beautiful car ever built with good dynamics and a fair turn of speed. Perhaps that's why so many are being re built.
I know MadMax has just bought a beautiful S3 which will no doubt increase in value. thumbs
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#448607 - 13/05/17 01:18 PM Re: Jaguar Classics: E-type rebuilds at a price! [Re: Aeroman]
mph Offline
Learner Plates Off!

Registered: 23/09/16
Posts: 431
The vast majority of people still buy classic cars for enjoyment and the vast majority of classic cars are still relatively affordable.

I'm in two Jaguar clubs, have loads of friends with classic cars, and I don't know a single person that has bought purely for investment.

The fact that classic cars tend to hold onto their value does make ownership more attractive, but what's wrong with that ?

I'll be selling my E Type when it's finished simply because I can't afford to hold onto it as I have other cars that I need to plough money into.

I hope to make a profit, but in return, I've returned a neglected, undriveable car to good health and paid for a proper restoration using my own experience and the right people to ensure it's done correctly.

If it's bought by a speculator then good luck to them, at least the car exists and is in good order.

A friend has just paid strong money for a V12 E Type. He bought it because it's a life long ambition that he can finally realise. He partly justified it (and convinced his wife) because he feels the value will remain in the car. Again, what's wrong with that ?

I do wonder why "enthusiasts' that now bemoan the high price of certain classic cars, didn''t buy them when they were affordable.

I owned my first E Type when I was 25 and newly married. It was either that or furnish the house. It cost me £4500 and I sold it for £5000 a couple of years later.

Hopefully that still makes me more of an enthusiast than a speculator. wink

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#448611 - 13/05/17 01:43 PM Re: Jaguar Classics: E-type rebuilds at a price! [Re: howard]
mph Offline
Learner Plates Off!

Registered: 23/09/16
Posts: 431
Originally Posted By howard
... And talking to the restorers of these cars, they indicated a cost of 50 to 100k to do the restoration all to an excellent standard.


Restoration covers a multitude of sins.

A restoration to the same standard of the Jaguar "works" cars or any proper restoration company is impossible for £50k.

£100k may be achievable, although I doubt it, but only if the owner did a lot of the work themselves and found someone with a body jig, the necessary knowledge and skills and who was willing to work for £30/hr and not charge VAT.

If you know of such a person please let me know wink

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#448639 - 13/05/17 05:17 PM Re: Jaguar Classics: E-type rebuilds at a price! [Re: mph]
AJSki2fly Offline
Drive on the Wild Side
Part of the Furniture

Registered: 11/05/11
Posts: 4896
Loc: Seaton, Devon, UK
Originally Posted By mph
Originally Posted By howard
... And talking to the restorers of these cars, they indicated a cost of 50 to 100k to do the restoration all to an excellent standard.


Restoration covers a multitude of sins.

A restoration to the same standard of the Jaguar "works" cars or any proper restoration company is impossible for £50k.

£100k may be achievable, although I doubt it, but only if the owner did a lot of the work themselves and found someone with a body jig, the necessary knowledge and skills and who was willing to work for £30/hr and not charge VAT.

If you know of such a person please let me know wink




I would agree, having restored a flat floor e-type over 6 years started 27 years ago, I sourced all original Jaguar parts, either new or had them refurbished, the only non original was the space frame (for safety reasons). It cost me £25k back then with me doing the majority of the work to exacting standards. Effectively a new car to concours. To do the same now multiply by at least 6-8 times, by the way some of the components will be very expensive if not impossible to source!!!
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#448760 - 14/05/17 04:00 PM Re: Jaguar Classics: E-type rebuilds at a price! [Re: Aeroman]
sospan Offline
Charter Member

Registered: 31/05/10
Posts: 5676
Loc: Llanelli
Why try to restore to perfect, concours, better than/same as factory?
Unless the car has some particular history surely not worth it. Even then keeping the patina of ,say, a race pedigree car would be better?
Impossible to recoup the cost other than for a small number of "special" cars.
Paying £££££ for originality of parts for the average car is worth it?
I would think safety, reliability, improvement upgrades is a better route to end up with a better driving car. Add on reasonable cosmetics and away you go.
My thoughts are based on a driveable car rather than the garage queens/high provenance cars.
In the end it depends on what your end target is.
Remember, paying a premium for an expensively restored car means you may not want to risk driving it.


Edited by sospan (14/05/17 04:02 PM)
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#448770 - 14/05/17 05:09 PM Re: Jaguar Classics: E-type rebuilds at a price! [Re: sospan]
Hamwich Online   content

Talk Morgan Sage

Registered: 28/04/08
Posts: 6750
Loc: Gloucestershire, UK
Originally Posted By sospan

Remember, paying a premium for an expensively restored car means you may not want to risk driving it.


+1

I can't imagine anything sadder than saving up for ages to buy the car of your dreams and then realising you've got too much invested in it to risk using it.

Much better to buy a slightly scruffier example, that way you can thrash it around and enjoy it without worrying, plus you get to spend the money that you've saved on other toys.
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#448771 - 14/05/17 05:19 PM Re: Jaguar Classics: E-type rebuilds at a price! [Re: Aeroman]
mph Offline
Learner Plates Off!

Registered: 23/09/16
Posts: 431
It really depends on what the starting point for the car is.

If it needs a total restoration, as many do, why not do it properly ? They were never designed to last for 50+ years and some of the structural elements should be renewed as a matter of course IMHO.

If it doesn't need a restoration then don't do it. Simples.

E Types were built to a price and like many cars of the period rustproofing was virtually non-existent.

It makes sense on a full restoration to take a little more time over panel fit, paint and rustproofing etc. It will pay dividends in the long term.

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#448784 - 14/05/17 06:17 PM Re: Jaguar Classics: E-type rebuilds at a price! [Re: sospan]
madmax Offline
Part of the Furniture

Registered: 18/08/14
Posts: 4205
Loc: East Anglia
Originally Posted By sospan
Why try to restore to perfect, concours, better than/same as factory?
Unless the car has some particular history surely not worth it. Even then keeping the patina of ,say, a race pedigree car would be better?
Impossible to recoup the cost other than for a small number of "special" cars.
Paying £££££ for originality of parts for the average car is worth it?
I would think safety, reliability, improvement upgrades is a better route to end up with a better driving car. Add on reasonable cosmetics and away you go.
My thoughts are based on a driveable car rather than the garage queens/high provenance cars.
In the end it depends on what your end target is.
Remember, paying a premium for an expensively restored car means you may not want to risk driving it.



Absolutely agree , this restoration craze seems to have gone too far , and after spending vast amounts on the car you won't then drive it as its cost too much in my view.
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#448786 - 14/05/17 06:21 PM Re: Jaguar Classics: E-type rebuilds at a price! [Re: lowebird]
madmax Offline
Part of the Furniture

Registered: 18/08/14
Posts: 4205
Loc: East Anglia
Originally Posted By lowebird
Originally Posted By howard
Originally Posted By Jays
I'd love to see them being built too!

I wonder how their search for cars to rebuild will affect prices?


Not much. I cant see them selling more than a handful at that price level and there are lots of E types around. There were 4 of them at my recent classic car meet out of a total of maybe 20 cars in all. And talking to the restorers of these cars, they indicated a cost of 50 to 100k to do the restoration all to an excellent standard.

Cant help but feel that this initiative is just another indication of the classic car bubble reaching its peak. The collectables cycle has happened before and will happen again as the economy begins to cool down, house prices weaken and interest rates start to improve.


IMHO, having owned and sold a beautiful S1 o.t.s. E type, you can never see enough E types, for me even as a rabid Ferrari fan, the E is still the most beautiful car ever built with good dynamics and a fair turn of speed. Perhaps that's why so many are being re built.
I know MadMax has just bought a beautiful S3 which will no doubt increase in value. thumbs



Reg , you have plenty of experience with iconic motors , I hope your latest toy has now arrived ? !
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