I like it,
also the fact they want to make it a bit more normal on some points (wipers/doorhandles/...)

I would like to see:
double clutch automatic
adjustable shocks
very very simple dashboard
very supportive seats

I really like the First drawing.

For me, if they are going for a 4 places, only 300bhp, it is to create a comfortable sport car for relax cruising. (Like the Ferrari California, Jaguar XK,...)

so I would like to see:
*Comfort oriented suspension.
*Simple refine interior Design.
*Quite inside, even at +100 mph.
*Better and softer steering.
*Better air conditioning/Heater control and sealing.

Steven,
I have only one word- twice:
excitement, excitement.

G

Interesting points Steven and some great ideas.

PDK would be cool, but I think the weight penalty is going to be too great given the strict weight target. (I still don't see how they are going to a make a bigger car weigh less than an Aeromax)

Adjustable shocks - sounds good. Magnetic dampers? Like the magic Audi a8 ones might be ideal?

Simple dashboard - something like the Rolls Royce approach?



Rather too much wood there I think, but the general simplicity of everything is very nice.



Also like the turned metal from the series 1 Aero - but perhaps another fine example is the Bentley Arnage T.

Also I'd want to see quality switches all the way through. Metal flip switches, not plastic buttons. Knurled ally dials, and chrome plated (if not actually metal) air grilles.

Good seats are a must, and the must fold and slide to provide good access to the rear. A good example for this is the Maserati Coupes - 3200/4200/Gransport GranTurismo, that provide adequate access space for adults..

I'd also want proper aerodynamics - a diffuser that really works and provides downforce - as well as resolving the rear of the car well.

I'd like to see sidepipes as well - or at least flush mounted rear pipes..

Ok - enough of me bitching about power levels. The straight six with twin turbos (N55) looks like it will offer substantial options for tweaking anyway.

I've sent a couple of mailsto get some suggestions, but being a Turbo engine, the option to increase power on an aftermarket basis is significant, so maybe I don't need to worry about that side of things after all..

friend has this engine: 361 (euro) HP and 400+NM

dashboard: more like TRAD
LESS IS MORE

I'm reading the book "how steve (jobs) thinks"
the key of his view on "his" products: the more you leave out of it, the better the consumer can and feel comfy using them

The MMC-boys should read that book!!!!!

Tony: good point on double-clutch!!!!, I've decided already: manual, roll-bar etc (99?GT3-style)

So should Microsft!

Cheers,

You start this thread to discuss the car and make a point of saying it isn't a discussion about MMC but then you make the comment above!

As for quoting Apple as inspiration for MMC - let me lay my cards on the table: the founders of Apple made a great product but due to various factor - not the least poor business practice - ended up with a superior product that had less than 15% of the global market in their sector. when you drill down, you realise that the company has been unstable on more than one occasion and it has only been by clever development of new products that they have survived; the iMac (coloured laptop) was the first booster and then the iPod and iPhone have pushed them back into a strong position. Therefore, while their core product is still a marginal player within their industry, the side projects have 'made the bacon' and 'saved the farm'. With that in mind, do we want Morgan to start making lawnmowers, electric generators or BBQs, in an effort to see another 100-years or do we want them to continue to develop their product line and make beautiful hand crafted cars?

Just my 2-pence and while I have an iPhone, quite a few iPods and an iPad, I cannot fathom the blind loyalty that many Apple-lovers provide while they worship at the temple of Jobs and Wozniak.

Now, as per your suggestion, discussion the EvaGT: -

I would like the company to get the balance between sporting and GT right. A GT, imho, means you can mile-munch in it in comfort as well as having the necessary gadgets (proper climate control, sat nav, reasonable stereo, etc) but also feeling like you are sitting in something special. There needs to be a sense of occasion about the interior.

The sporting aspect is Morgans heritage, the car needs to soak up bumps (hence GT) but also perform when the road starts to bend. Magnetic dampers are probably a development too far for MMC; however, a well sorted suspension will provide for the above requirement.

Styling, I'd like it to be graceful and masculine - with a hint of Aero-line but really moving that design language forward.

I'm happy with the engine - BMW made strong engines and to be honest, the search for more and more power in an era where the government/police are talking about more and more average speed cameras, seems somewhat pointless. Sub 6-seconds to 60mph will be just fine for me. Now that Aero Racing is really coming into play, there is no reason why MMC cannot offer a performance pack, via Aero Racing, post purchase for those who want a higher state of tune. In fact, this would work better for me because after 12-months, it gives you the option to purchase it and feel like you've got a new car! What I would want to see is a large capacity fuel tank - there is nothing worse than a long distance tourer that needs to stop every 200-miles for a refill (I sold my E60 M5 for this reason).

That about covers it for now.

Back to the Temple of Apple

or golf carts???
I guess HD got away with those though...



Agree with that. GT = Gran Turismo - grand touring...
Having just driven a number of rather 'exotic' motors on track near Loughborough, the DB9, too big/heavy for much track use gave me the feeling I could just climb in at home and be in the Highlands a few hours later, feeling as fresh as if I'd just stepped out of the front door - that's true GT to me. Coming on the heels of a Scooby, 997, Nissan GTR it felt rather barge-like, but oh so comfortable. Gaillardo and Evo 9 (I think it was a 9) were also interesting, but for all round enjoyment on track the 997 was my favourite...

Cheers,

The EvaGT chassis is an aero chassis, likely stretched a bit to accomodate two seats for short legged passengers. So I wouldn t expect much change on the way the car will handle

Being longer, it might be more stable at high speeds, but being less agile in sharp turns.

In the meantime, with a longer chassis, the ground clearance should be marginally lower, forcing to either put higher wheels or raise the suspension

None of these choices will make the car more confortable than an Aero.

The engine being a straight six is likely to be longer than the current V8, hence putting more weight on the front wheels. As a consequence, the nose might be heavier

Honestly, whilst the max has 70 BHP or so more than the EvaGT, I tend to think that 300 HP in a 1200 kilo car is more than enough to make it fast...

Having driven my Aeromax for 20.000 kilometers, hereafter some points which I think should be improved should a true GT be designed

1-The steering isn t great. It is too light, the feedback is marginal, and it doesn't self center.

Whilst I changed the set up (A bit more camber and toe out) and therefore improved a bit the steering, it is milles away from what you get from a Lotus or a Caterham

2-The suspension is quite harsh at low speeds.

I think the wheel travel distance is limited and the car is firmly springed. Rose joints don t help either. At speed, things are much better I must say, but in town, my personal sensors located in an intimate place, can read the brand name on every cigarette bud I drive over. Rose joints are also noisy.

3-Acces in the car is a challenge for overweighted and ageing drivers

Whilst this wouldn t be a concern to many of you, I personally have a challenge on this. Not only the door aperture is limited in high, the sills are massive, but also the steering wheel is very low.

4-Heating and air conditioning are to be improved

I have not yet the new fan fitted, but in short, so far, I have two choices in summer:
-Hot and silent
-Hot and noisy

And in winter, I also have two choices:
-Cold and silent
-Cold and noisy

The fan doesn t push enough air in the car, the doors aren t tight, a lot of cold comes from the door speakers and the air vents are in unsufficient number

5- Electrickery

A GT should not open their door windows when it rains, open the boot, shut the light under heavy rain. The cruise control should work at all times, the tyre pressure should work. The main wires should not be bolted by ridiculous screws which are underdimensioned

I know by experience that getting this isn t easy but it can be done

Now, don t get me wrong:

I am deeply in love with the Aeroamx. After 40 cars or so, this one is still a delight 18 months after I got it. None of my previous cars was kept for so long and I can t remeber having enjoyed so much any car I ever had. I think, I will keep this for as long as I or my sons can drive it

The defaults I mentioned here, are a price to pay for the heritage of the car and its low volume of production. However, I think some of the issues could be adressed without much costs, just by testing and testing and testing AGAIN AND AGAIN

If you are after a practical GT with all the toys you may dream off, MP3, TV, massage seats, cup holders, relaibility etc.... buy an Audi or BMW. I had several of these, and they are to me, as exciting as a micro wave or a dishwasher. Perefct machines with no soul, purely functional

If you want a car with character and emotional appeal, buy Morgan.

And register with AA or the RAC....

Just a quick note - got some data back from a tuner (more tomorrow) and it's a truly impressive engine MMC have selected).

I take back all the concerns I raised - it seems this is incredibly tunable and versatile engine and will easily offer imressive gains to those who want to tweak their Eva GT for a bit more 'welly'. Seems like the perfect choice for this car.

I'll post up the info I have tomorrow.

got full n° from my friends Z4 35i:
361 pk en 575 Nm @ 3919 Tr/Min
yihaaaaa!!!!!!

I have graphs ;-)

...

OK - DMS Automotive in Southampton provided me this printout of the tuning opportunity (remap) for a 335i N55 engine..



Looks promising - 375bhp and >400lbb/ft of torque. Probably enough for me!

Incidentally they also offer a remap of the 4.8 S4 engine that adds around 35bhp. Interesting.

Remaps for <1000 quid including VAT. DMS has a good reputation in this area, I know a fair number of porsche folk who swear by their upgrades to the 996TT.

imho Max/S4 allready have (more than) enough power for their traction, mine drifts away pretty often now that I trust its behaviour at the limit

Still - nice option for the 6 pot engine though!

for sure, are you ordering????
I'm but my dealer is on holiday

There is supposed to be a link on the website to take a deposit on line. At least that's what the factory told me yesterday.

Still no sign of the link though..

They were having issues with it. I know they are working to resolve them asap.

I am not really sure why that is such an issue about power for the new EvaGT, as it is as the name says a Grand Tourer and as Simon says, for me anything under 6.0 sec for 0-100kph is quick enough for this application.

Based on information that we gleaned at the factory, it will be a full 4-seater (I'm sure that's in a GT context, if you follow my assumption) and not an additional 2-jump seats a la 911/Evora.

If they are able to hit the weight target of 1250 kg's, the same as a Series IV Aero for what must be a bigger car, then the bhp per tonne looks like this.

Model/weight(kgs)/BHP/ = bhp per tonne

EvaGT/1250/306 bhp = 245 bhp per tonne

We have recently owned the following competing GT's and these are their power to weight stats:

GranTurismo/1880/400 bhp = 213 bhp per tonne

Porsche/1605/345 bhp = 215 bhp per tonne

Bristol/1650/380 bhp = 230 bhp per tonne

It would seem that the EvaGT is more than competitive using the power to weight criteria, though I feel that torque and how it delivers its power is actually more important in this application.

The GranTurismo actually felt somewhat underpowered as its peak power was developed at 7100 rpm and its peak torque at 4750 rpm, so you felt that you were always having to 'push it' to extract its performance. It was heavy too and thus you needed the S really which has 230 bhp per tonne, but still develops its power and torque at 7000 and 4750 rpm respectively.

The standard 911 develops a similar power to weight ratio and peak power and torque are at 6800 and 4250 rpm, but the PDK box makes the difference and the car feels lively at all times, basically because it always seems to be in the right gear.

Bristol do not quote power and torque figures, but it is generally accepted that the power is around 380 bhp, not unreasonable for a 6.9 litre mill. The torque is prodigious, as it needs to be as it is geared 40.76 mph per thousand revs in top.

I know which of the three cars I would rather drive down the Autoroute to the South of France in one day in.

The Eva being a twin-turbo with 400 nm of torque (300 ft lbs at 1300 to 5000 rpm) and a pretty light car, this is key to the mix, I don't see why it can't be competitive out-of-the box, and there is little doubt that by the time it is launched BMW will have extracted more bhp/torque out of this engine.

If you want ultimate Morgan performance get an Aero Series IV (or tune an Aero or a Roadster), but let's keep the Eva as a true GT as it is not conceived as a pure sportscar or a Series IV replacement.

they speak of "first batch of production run limited to 100cars"
could this mean EVA will have other versions, like the hybrid being a next batch of 100 EVA-h, and a new GTN, with 'M' or '.35iS' engine?????

:wave: I think the only one being concerned about power was me! Don't want to tar anyone with my brush! So back on my I've removed those reservations based on the tunablity of the engine and the ample torque available from the twin turbo set up. SO I publicly promise not to bang on about power any more. After this post! :beer:



I do really hope you are right, and I think if they can it will be amazing. Looking at the hole rather than the doughnut though the series 1 was supposed to be 1000kg - but was in reality more like 1150-1200.

The series 4 was supposed to be aroudn the same as the series 1, but tips the scales at 1350kg.

How Morgan can stretch the chassis to accomodate 2 more passengers, and put a coupe lid on the car, meet US crash regs, EU sound deadening regs and put in two more fully For reference the Lotus Evora tips the scales at 1350 (dry) and has a compact v6, as well as tiny rear chairs.



I do agree and again I hope MMC can hit the target as the car will be a true engineering marvel. If for a moment though I suspend hope (looking at that hole in the doughnut again) then that 2 extra seats, plus extra chassis + extra crash protection, carpets and sound deadening, glass, upholstery, larger brakes are likely add only 200kg over the Series 4 Aero. Which gives us 1550kg which is a bit less than 20% over the estimated kerb weight - a similar margin of error as for the S1.

Doing the calcs for 1550kg the power to weight is 193bhp per tonne. Ok thats not a terrible figure, and for most it would feel more than adequate. For me though (indulge me) if I'm having to give up my Series IV, to have the EVA I would prefer to still have the option of at least a similar sensation of thrust! Besides if the car is giving up power on the pretext of being lightweight, and it's not really, then it would feel a bit of a letdown I think.



I do completely see where you're coming from, and of course as a prospective purchaser I do hope that the quoted weight is realistic.

Equally as I've pointed out, with the engine tunable to a comfortable 374bhp, with would provide a very healthy 240bhp per tonne (Even at 1550kg) - which may not be anywhere the ultimate performance of a Series II with the wick turned up (Boshers!) but certainly enough to feel that you haven't missed out too badly if trading on from a Series IV (aprpox 260bhp/tonne).

Even better if the eVA really does come in at 1250kg, with 375bhp it's running 299bhp per tonne, which should be ample to keep and accompanying canine with it's face pressed to the rear screen


I'm still sold - lets hope we get to see more teaser pics soon, can't wait to see what it looks like - surely it's sitting in a well protected shed in Malvern right now looking amazing.

I think quite a few of us are, I'm told the website for ordering will be up this afternoon. I hope so as I would like to formalise my verbal order to Morgan.



We did a tour of the works and whilst we saw some interesting stuff, there was no sign of a EvaGT anywhere. They are going to have to get their skids on if it is to be shown at the Pebble Beach event this year methinks.

Fingers crossed the site it up later..

So what colour you thinking? I think this is the one that really will look great in Morris Marina Brown Aeroman ;-)

As you know Rich I use a highly paid consultant to help spec my cars and here he is working his way through the colour swatches at the new showroom in Malvern.


From the photo it looks like white is the new brown ...

what a fine looking fellow, though Im obviously not that way inclined

Gee! that new showroom is just Soooo atmospheric.(Not)
G

This picture:

and an other one can be seen on mogwire.com

I must say, that it's not at all my taste
Should this really be the future design of Morgan? Not for me I'm definitely the "trad" kind of guy

My apologies for being blunt but when has a 2 seat speedster concept from 1996 been relevant to the discussion of a 4 seat coupe? It feels as relevant as putting Eva GT on a photo of a Morgan Aero 8 mark 1. Typical rubbish found on the internet to encourage traffic.

I like the idea of the new Mog and if the Aeromax is anything to go on I believe it will be attractive and practical for those of us with families. Now time to start saving.

If you look at the original sketch (and of course the only real evidence we have to go on) from the press release, it clearly shows running boards / wings, and clearly shows an 'upright' headlight.



I think these are the two characteristics I expect (demand even!) to see in a Morgan. The rake of the screen and the treatment of the rear / roofline to mee are less important, but the upright grille and the sweep of the wings is what for me at least gives a car the shape that I would immediately identify as a Morgan.

Sure I expect these key traits to be subtly brought into the future, Matt Humphries is a talented stylist, so I'm sure we'll get something very handsome to look at. Both the Aeromax and the SuperSports are great to look at. I'd expect with a free hand to design this new car including the different wheelbase, and more freedom in terms of the front end of the car we will see something very special.

Just hope that we get more teasers soon!

The Morgan EvaGT ordering system is now live.

Peeps,

just losing some of my life on the interwebby and found something interesting. Given Morgans limited budget for developing cars and ability to use any and all scraps to best ability is the EvaGT simply the Lifecar MkII.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fn-1__Pg_jA&playnext_from=TL&videos=FhsmTaCy8_Q

This clip from youtube shows some renderings of the car, a little tweaking of the model brings us neatly to the EvaGT in profile as shown at the top of the thread.

I like the idea of having a hard top Aero 8 for less than the price of a Maxie/SSport. £80k would be the same as a fully loaded Aero S4 plus something for development costs and profit.

The emission controls on the BMW six twin turbo with direct injection are strong enough to go for a few years. Additionally the power to weight ratio is pretty good. As MrTony points out, electronic control of a twin turbo engine leaves plenty of room for tweaking. My old Skyline GTR certainly proved that, 550bhp without a hitch and 90,000 miles.

I would however prefer a rear window, paranoia on our public roads is all to high these days.

Some try to work on the official picture


from here: http://www.vroom.be/fr/actualite-auto/8126,morgan-evagt-2012.html

wondering how "fat" the front wings will be,
the rear are "fat" for sure,
a bit like new E-class and 993
(not in style but in "fatness")

hmmm, decent English?????

just hope there are runnning boards somehow...

don't think so,
damn curious is little me

I think the wings will be more like crease lines in the body.. with the rear tub moving out to near the full width.. and similar for the front end.

There seem to be some clues on www.mogwire.com which includes some 'other images'

may I ask you all:
when in contact with MMC on the EvaGT:
ask them to make sure we can put the ESP (obligatory on new cars from 2012) OFF

otherwise I swear: they can keep their newest sibling for themselves!!!!

Sure it will - not many cars (except mercedes) seem to stop you turning it off and as any t/c system is likely to be from BMW the 'off' option will I'm sure be carried over as well.

I had a chat with Charles yesterday when collecting my car as for me it has to be a decent set of rear seats rather than what you get in the XK8'S etc.

It will have pretty good seats in the back for children, not token cushions that aren't useable. Looking foirward to Pebble Beach!

just hope they get the build-quality alright,
hearing about aeroSS that are going back to the factory

can't complain on maxie, but heck, use it only for fun/once in a while, EVA-gt would be daily (with a Smart as back-up )

I think for you, you should keep it on! LOL

This Autocar news article on the EvaGT has been published on PH. It looks much more like the real thing then the model from the MMC museum published on MogWire.

Not long to wait now, an article and photos will appear on the MMC site on the 16th August 2010.

Unfortunately for those mere mortals amongst us, it is unlikely we'll ever afford one

I feel Nerdy.......
and the front is not my cup of chocomilk
gril with the "fat pillar" in the middle is more Bugatti than Morgan, but as always, scetches are "over-expressive"

will judge on pictures

the grill on this sketch is not realy "morganic"...

Just 4 days to wait

they've got to move on their game,
hope we can see the interior on pictures sunday-evening
but I think I'll wait for ordering till I drove one

Well sadly I'm not going to be in California next week as originally planned as I'm moving house instead. Oh well.

I will have to drive the Eva and decide if I can stick my hard earned ££ into one, or if I will stick with the S4 for as long as I can get away with.

Can't wait for the press release on Monday

How can a car be judged on a line sketch? Best to wait until you see it.

how can you judge a car by its looks,
drive it and then decide!!!

no kidding: I'm going to ask 100questions on how/where/how long they test-drove it before releasing it,
I volunteer for doing a hundred laps on the Northloop,
got Jahreskarte so only costs rear tires/brakepads and fuel

Hi Steven,

Like this ? Video

sorry for the the black (coming back) german humor.

Looking forward to meeting you in the not too distant future. Need a Nürburg driving lesson.

_________________________
Oliver

Oliver,

vid: simon made that, I have the in-car-footage too
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s5d9UAlcKX8

RING: I'll let you now when I'm going!!!!, for first rounds we better meet on a thursday-evening

grtz,
steven