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1st startup in a year, advice needed please... #590668
19/08/19 03:01 PM
19/08/19 03:01 PM
Joined: Jun 2019
Posts: 2
Windlesham, GB
J
Jemboe Offline OP
New to Talk Morgan
Jemboe  Offline OP
New to Talk Morgan
J

Joined: Jun 2019
Posts: 2
Windlesham, GB
Hi,

I'm totally unfamiliar with the M3W, and I've been given custody of a 2012 model that hasn't started in well over a year. I've got some basic mechanical experience, and I've got a couple of concerns...

There is an inspection hole in the bell housing, and from here engine oil seems to be leaking and then dripping from the lowest point of the housing/ gearbox casing, there's a notable/ sizable pool on the garage floor, but that may be historic. The oil header tank is empty, so...

... should there be oil weeping, dripping from the bell housing? Or is this likely to be a crankshaft seal?
... how can I double check the oil level before attempting to start the engine up?

I've tried aged posts in the forum, but can't find much on this subject...

TIA!
Jim

-----------------------------------------------------------------
The wife says I'm a star - in that I'm dim & distant.


The wife says I'm a star, in that I'm quite dim and very distant.
Re: 1st startup in a year, advice needed please... [Re: Jemboe] #590676
19/08/19 03:22 PM
19/08/19 03:22 PM
Joined: Feb 2018
Posts: 188
SW Iowa, U.S.A.
Bitsobrits Offline
L - Learner Plates On
Bitsobrits  Offline
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Joined: Feb 2018
Posts: 188
SW Iowa, U.S.A.
Jim,

There should not be oil leaking from the bell housing, but that may be due to the sump being full of oil.

These engines are dry sump engines, in that the oil scavenge pump keeps the crankcase clear of excess oil while running by pumping it back up to the tank under the bonnet. If this header tank is empty, perhaps the engine has been 'wet sumped', i.e. all the oil draining back through the pump into the crankcase and overwhelming the seals. This can happen when the machine is left to sit for long periods.

Before cranking over, I would recommend you first drain the sump completely (female hex head plug dead center under engine) then refill the header tank with 5qts of fresh air cooled motorcycle oil. After running a couple of minutes, you can check the oil level and add more if required. Capacity is a nominal 6qts with filter change and the hoses fully drained. Note that the engine, including drain plug, has SAE sized fasteners, while the rest of the machine is pretty much metric.

I would not recommend starting the engine if the sump is truly full of oil as you risk blowing out a crank seal. At a minimum you will likely be greeted by a large burp of oil into the intake manifold and out the air cleaner.

To get it started, turn on the key and listen for the fuel pump pressurizing the fuel system. Then turn the key all the way off and do it again. This gives an extra rich mixture which may aid the starting process. And make sure the battery is fully charged as these big twins take a bit of grunt to get them going.


Last edited by Bitsobrits; 19/08/19 03:25 PM.

Steve
2012 M3W #458
SW Iowa

Re: 1st startup in a year, advice needed please... [Re: Jemboe] #590677
19/08/19 03:24 PM
19/08/19 03:24 PM
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 326
North London
K
KBMOG Offline
Learner Plates Off!
KBMOG  Offline
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K

Joined: May 2014
Posts: 326
North London
The oil may have drained slowly through the oil pump and is now in the sump.

The first thing to do would be to remove the sump plug and collect any oil that may be in the sump (in a clean container) and tip it back into the oil tank, not forgetting to replace the sump plug after draining the oil from it.
Before starting the engine, momentarily disconnect the oil feed pipe at the engine end to ensure you have oil present at this point.
It should then be OK to attempt to start the engine

Re: 1st startup in a year, advice needed please... [Re: Jemboe] #590681
19/08/19 03:33 PM
19/08/19 03:33 PM
Joined: Feb 2018
Posts: 188
SW Iowa, U.S.A.
Bitsobrits Offline
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Bitsobrits  Offline
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Joined: Feb 2018
Posts: 188
SW Iowa, U.S.A.
Also, this manual should prove useful going forward:

https://www.sscycle.com/docs/defaul...edge-owners-manual-20160524.pdf?sfvrsn=4

Besides this most excellent forum, the Morgan Three Wheeler club site (MTWC.co.uk) has several useful articles on the new 3 wheelers.


Steve
2012 M3W #458
SW Iowa

Re: 1st startup in a year, advice needed please... [Re: Jemboe] #590698
19/08/19 04:44 PM
19/08/19 04:44 PM
Joined: Jul 2019
Posts: 230
L
Luddite Offline
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Joined: Jul 2019
Posts: 230
Never been involved with a three wheeler old or new but messed with loads of m/cycles..... The guys who have already commented covered the expected oil in sump after lay up situation, the only other suggestion I might have is once you have put the oil back in the tank, remove the spark plugs and spin the engine over to give the oil time to recirculate around the engine.... However if there is a fuel pump, I might pull it`s relay. and disconnect the power to the coil to kill the sparks... I am not keen on firing up engines on which the lube may have drained down during lay-up..

Re: 1st startup in a year, advice needed please... [Re: Jemboe] #590711
19/08/19 05:36 PM
19/08/19 05:36 PM
Joined: Feb 2018
Posts: 121
Seattle, WA.
3Gs Offline
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3Gs  Offline
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Joined: Feb 2018
Posts: 121
Seattle, WA.
Oil coming out of that hole in the bell housing can definitely come from from a leaking rear main crank seal.

This is why it was leaking from there in my experince; http://www.talkmorgan.com/ubbthreads.php/topics/569089/a-reason-why-m3ws-leak-oil#Post569089

Re: 1st startup in a year, advice needed please... [Re: Jemboe] #590717
19/08/19 06:31 PM
19/08/19 06:31 PM
Joined: Aug 2013
Posts: 1,300
Cheshire, UK
nippymog Offline
Has a lot to Say!
nippymog  Offline
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Joined: Aug 2013
Posts: 1,300
Cheshire, UK
You have probably got this but:
After a year any petrol still in the system probably wont be petrol any more , so it will be best to drain it.
Getting a sample out to prove this would be a good idea.
If it smells like varnish its has gone bad. It should sting your nose when you smell it - you can tell the difference.
The tanks could be emptied by loosening the balance pipe joining the two tanks ?
Whats in the rest of the system will probably need flushing somehow - use the pump to flush it out ? ( highly dangerous of course !!)

Re: 1st startup in a year, advice needed please... [Re: Jemboe] #590725
19/08/19 06:54 PM
19/08/19 06:54 PM
Joined: Apr 2018
Posts: 34
Colorado, USA
A
AncientMariner Offline
Just Getting Started
AncientMariner  Offline
Just Getting Started
A

Joined: Apr 2018
Posts: 34
Colorado, USA
The holes in the bottom of the bell housing are for greasing the compensator on the 2012 model.


John, retired Marine Engineer
87 Morgan +8+, 12 Morgan 3W
Re: 1st startup in a year, advice needed please... [Re: Jemboe] #590848
20/08/19 12:42 PM
20/08/19 12:42 PM
Joined: Jun 2019
Posts: 2
Windlesham, GB
J
Jemboe Offline OP
New to Talk Morgan
Jemboe  Offline OP
New to Talk Morgan
J

Joined: Jun 2019
Posts: 2
Windlesham, GB
Thanks to you all! I'll be under it over the weekend so will report back.


The wife says I'm a star, in that I'm quite dim and very distant.
Re: 1st startup in a year, advice needed please... [Re: Jemboe] #591032
21/08/19 02:39 PM
21/08/19 02:39 PM
Joined: Nov 2013
Posts: 1,454
Aberdeenshire
T
TimG Offline
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TimG  Offline
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Joined: Nov 2013
Posts: 1,454
Aberdeenshire
From the book Oil 20W-50 v Twin, 6 litres total fill. Early cars had a dipstick attached to the oil filler cap , later cars have a bar in the tank, should be up to the bar. If its been sat for a long time an early oil & filer change would not be out of order.
The fuel could be flushed out by disconnecting the hose at the engine & using the fuel pump. If the fuel hose has a crimped fastener you cannot reuse & need to replace with proper hose clamps not jubilee clips. Its a good idea to replace the crimped hose clamps anyway. The fuel pump sits in the fuel tank & is cooled by the fuel so dont run it on after the fuel it emptied. We look forward to hearing how you get on & some photos.

Tim

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