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Re: Workshop Note: LED Headlamps [Re: DaveW] #668165
21/10/20 06:57 AM
21/10/20 06:57 AM
Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 1,328
North Somerset, UK
Deejay Offline
Has a lot to Say!
Deejay  Offline
Has a lot to Say!

Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 1,328
North Somerset, UK
Agree that a light and bright clothing helps to be seen but I think the argument of poor eyesight judgement, focuses on the brighter the lights, the worse it might be. So although in Norway, everyone drives with lights on, have they all converted to brighter LEDs?
As a one time biker, a common experience was car drivers pulling out from junctions in front of me, thinking (incorrectly)that they had plenty of time to do so. I am sure other bikers will have experienced the same.
So perhaps the point is not necessarily don’t use lights but more so, don’t think that the brighter they are, the safer you will be.


Doug

2011 +4 in Rich Maroon
1972 750 “ComDom” sprinter
1958 Triton 650
1992 Triumph Trophy 900
Re: Workshop Note: LED Headlamps [Re: DaveW] #668168
21/10/20 07:03 AM
21/10/20 07:03 AM
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 23,408
Suffolk, England
John V6 Offline
Brooklands Register contact
John V6  Offline
Brooklands Register contact
Member of the Inner Circle

Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 23,408
Suffolk, England
My half moon LEDs in the headlights & side lights on did F**k all when white van man T boned me. I agree they may help but I wouldn't rely purely on your DRLs.


JohnV6
2014 Brooklands Edition Roadster "Brookland's Belle" #5 of 50
Re: Workshop Note: LED Headlamps [Re: DaveW] #668171
21/10/20 07:09 AM
21/10/20 07:09 AM
Joined: Nov 2018
Posts: 4,840
Northants, UK
TBM Offline
Part of the Furniture
TBM  Offline
Part of the Furniture

Joined: Nov 2018
Posts: 4,840
Northants, UK
I'm of the opinion that if you need DRL to see a car/bike in broad daylight. then you shouldn't be driving. smile smile


1972 4/4 4 seater - 3G Morganeer
Too many ratty motorbikes
Re: Workshop Note: LED Headlamps [Re: DaveW] #668193
21/10/20 09:59 AM
21/10/20 09:59 AM
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 8,587
Llanelli
sospan Offline
Needs to Get Out More!
sospan  Offline
Needs to Get Out More!

Joined: May 2010
Posts: 8,587
Llanelli
A person’s brain to eye link is not continuous. As you scan side to side you get gaps as your brain jumps slightly causing blind spots where the image is not registered. A while back I posted a link to a site describing this effect and how fighter pilots were trained to scan differently so as not to create these blind spots. I’ll have a look for the link as I think it also used car driving as well.
The phenomenum is based on Saccadic eye movement. Still searching for the link!
Here’s a link that shows theeffect on what we register as seeing....
https://youtu.be/qIF3FRwbG6Y

Last edited by sospan; 21/10/20 10:25 AM.

Red Plus8
Re: Workshop Note: LED Headlamps [Re: DaveW] #668203
21/10/20 10:20 AM
21/10/20 10:20 AM
Joined: Nov 2018
Posts: 4,840
Northants, UK
TBM Offline
Part of the Furniture
TBM  Offline
Part of the Furniture

Joined: Nov 2018
Posts: 4,840
Northants, UK
Hence the good old 'Think once, think twice, think Bike' smile



1972 4/4 4 seater - 3G Morganeer
Too many ratty motorbikes
Re: Workshop Note: LED Headlamps [Re: DaveW] #668212
21/10/20 12:20 PM
21/10/20 12:20 PM
Joined: Apr 2019
Posts: 893
Lancashire
RobCol Offline
Talk Morgan Regular
RobCol  Offline
Talk Morgan Regular

Joined: Apr 2019
Posts: 893
Lancashire

People dont see things they arent looking for



FINISHED FILES ARE THE RES-
ULT OF YEARS OF SCIENTIF-
IC STUDY COMBINED WITH THE
EXPERIENCE OF MANY YEARS



How many letter F s above?


Rob

4/4 Sport Grey

Re: Workshop Note: LED Headlamps [Re: RobCol] #668227
21/10/20 01:45 PM
21/10/20 01:45 PM
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 11,066
Gloucestershire, UK
Hamwich Offline
Scruffy Oik
Hamwich  Offline
Scruffy Oik
Member of the Inner Circle

Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 11,066
Gloucestershire, UK
Originally Posted by RobCol

People dont see things they arent looking for



FINISHED FILES ARE THE RES-
ULT OF YEARS OF SCIENTIF-
IC STUDY COMBINED WITH THE
EXPERIENCE OF MANY YEARS



How many letter F s above?


OK, I'll bite. 7 (or 8 if you count the one in the question)?


Tim H.
1986 4/4 VVTi Sport, 2002 LR Defender, 2022 Mini Cooper SE
Re: Workshop Note: LED Headlamps [Re: Deejay] #668237
21/10/20 03:24 PM
21/10/20 03:24 PM
Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 459
Bergen, Norway
R
Robbie Mathisen Offline
Learner Plates Off!
Robbie Mathisen  Offline
Learner Plates Off!
R

Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 459
Bergen, Norway
Originally Posted by Deejay
Agree that a light and bright clothing helps to be seen but I think the argument of poor eyesight judgement, focuses on the brighter the lights, the worse it might be. So although in Norway, everyone drives with lights on, have they all converted to brighter LEDs?
As a one time biker, a common experience was car drivers pulling out from junctions in front of me, thinking (incorrectly)that they had plenty of time to do so. I am sure other bikers will have experienced the same.
So perhaps the point is not necessarily don’t use lights but more so, don’t think that the brighter they are, the safer you will be.

No, not everbody but almost. A mix of HID/Xenon and LED (EVs are selling a LOT here, they all have LED) and then a decreasing number of halogen. Provided these powerful lights are well adjusted and have mandatory cleaning and automatic levelling devices, there are no problems. As for poor eyesight, when you grow older you will get gradually less sensitive to light, partly because the lens is growing slightly opaque as years pass by. I would think this demands for stronger light, not the opposite. And distance judgement is mainly dependent on stereoscopic sight which is what we have with two parallell visual axis. I do not think this differs with the iris open or closed. I think the trouble with bikes is that they have only one light. When a car approaches I automatically make a judgement based upon the two headlamps that give me an indication of the size and thus distance to the vehicle. Much more difficult with a one-eyed bike....
I do not think it is that complicated. I want to see, and equally or even more important I want to be seen. Apart from the physical appearance of the car (or bike) there is not much more than a good light I can rely on. So I follow suit. If the majority of vehicles have HID/Xenon/LED, I will improve my headlights not to stand out in a negative way - not feeble, but not agressively bright either.


Robbie the Norseman
2004 V6 Roadster
Sherwood green
Re: Workshop Note: LED Headlamps [Re: TBM] #668245
21/10/20 03:38 PM
21/10/20 03:38 PM
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 23,408
Suffolk, England
John V6 Offline
Brooklands Register contact
John V6  Offline
Brooklands Register contact
Member of the Inner Circle

Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 23,408
Suffolk, England
Originally Posted by TBM
Hence the good old 'Think once, think twice, think Bike' smile



Those are some stunts I hope on the bikes. That advert always made me wince as bike driver at the time.


JohnV6
2014 Brooklands Edition Roadster "Brookland's Belle" #5 of 50
Re: Workshop Note: LED Headlamps [Re: Deejay] #668250
21/10/20 04:00 PM
21/10/20 04:00 PM
Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 459
Bergen, Norway
R
Robbie Mathisen Offline
Learner Plates Off!
Robbie Mathisen  Offline
Learner Plates Off!
R

Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 459
Bergen, Norway
Originally Posted by Deejay
Agree that a light and bright clothing helps to be seen but I think the argument of poor eyesight judgement, focuses on the brighter the lights, the worse it might be. So although in Norway, everyone drives with lights on, have they all converted to brighter LEDs?
As a one time biker, a common experience was car drivers pulling out from junctions in front of me, thinking (incorrectly)that they had plenty of time to do so. I am sure other bikers will have experienced the same.
So perhaps the point is not necessarily don’t use lights but more so, don’t think that the brighter they are, the safer you will be.

No, not everbody but almost. A mix of HID/Xenon and LED (EVs are selling a LOT here, they all have LED) and then a decreasing number of halogen. Provided these powerful lights are well adjusted and have mandatory cleaning and automatic levelling devices, there are no problems. As for poor eyesight, when you grow older you will get gradually less sensitive to light, partly because the lens is growing slightly opaque as years pass by. I would think this demands for stronger light, not the opposite. And distance judgement is mainly dependent on stereoscopic sight which is what we have with two parallell visual axis. I do not think this differs with the iris open or closed. I think the trouble with bikes is that they have only one light. When a car approaches I automatically make a judgement based upon the two headlamps that give me an indication of the size and thus distance to the vehicle. Much more difficult with a one-eyed bike....
I do not think it is that complicated. I want to see, and equally or even more important I want to be seen. Apart from the physical appearance of the car (or bike) there is not much more than a good light I can rely on. So I follow suit. If the majority of vehicles have HID/Xenon/LED, I will improve my headlights not to stand out in a negative way - not feeble, but not agressively bright either.


Robbie the Norseman
2004 V6 Roadster
Sherwood green
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