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Radiator fix #739537
20/04/22 01:30 PM
20/04/22 01:30 PM
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John V6 Offline OP
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Dan at Krazy horse mentioned that the radiator has been fixed by replacing the cap with a lower pressure rating. Can anyone confirm if it does fix the leak issue and how can you tell by looking at the cap if it has been changed?


JohnV6
2014 Brooklands Edition Roadster "Brookland's Belle" #5 of 50
Re: Radiator fix [Re: John V6] #739538
20/04/22 01:37 PM
20/04/22 01:37 PM
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+8Rich Offline
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John, a PM to gaston or thiery242 could help as they have the new cap..and lots of not brilliant radiator experiences.


Regards Richard

1999 Indigo Blue +8
2009 4/4 Sport Green prev
1993 Connaught Green +8 prev





Re: Radiator fix [Re: John V6] #739543
20/04/22 02:04 PM
20/04/22 02:04 PM
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I think the lower pressure cap is combined with not topping up the header tank too high as well ?


Jon M
Re: Radiator fix [Re: John V6] #739544
20/04/22 02:10 PM
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Yes Jon, that's what these boys said as per dealers advise..


Regards Richard

1999 Indigo Blue +8
2009 4/4 Sport Green prev
1993 Connaught Green +8 prev





Re: Radiator fix [Re: +8Rich] #739547
20/04/22 02:22 PM
20/04/22 02:22 PM
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Originally Posted by +8Rich
Yes Jon, that's what these boys said as per dealers advise..

So, as I see it a WET system that becomes hydraulically locked by it's OE design...and blows things apart... doh


Jon M
Re: Radiator fix [Re: CooperMan] #739548
20/04/22 02:25 PM
20/04/22 02:25 PM
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Originally Posted by CooperMan
Originally Posted by +8Rich
Yes Jon, that's what these boys said as per dealers advise..

So, as I see it a WET system that becomes hydraulically locked by it's OE design...and blows things apart... doh

I'll go with that but surely this should have been remedied during the road testing period, I find it hard to believe MMC were not fully aware of these problems prior to releasing the cars to the public - again nono


The times I have counted my blessings by staying with the Plus 8 and not changed to a Plus Four you wouldn't believe.

My good lady suggested I got a new car last year bless her and I did a lot of homework but the sound track of the V8 faulty radiators and uncomfortable seats killed it off big time for me. To me both these faults had nothing whatsoever to do with it being a hand built car, just poor development prior to release.


Regards Richard

1999 Indigo Blue +8
2009 4/4 Sport Green prev
1993 Connaught Green +8 prev





Re: Radiator fix [Re: +8Rich] #739553
20/04/22 02:55 PM
20/04/22 02:55 PM
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Originally Posted by +8Rich
Originally Posted by CooperMan
Originally Posted by +8Rich
Yes Jon, that's what these boys said as per dealers advise..

So, as I see it a WET system that becomes hydraulically locked by it's OE design...and blows things apart... doh

I'll go with that but surely this should have been remedied during the road testing period, I find it hard to believe MMC were not fully aware of these problems prior to releasing the cars to the public - again nono


The times I have counted my blessings by staying with the Plus 8 and not changed to a Plus Four you wouldn't believe.

My good lady suggested I got a new car last year bless her and I did a lot of homework but the sound track and faulty radiators and uncomfortable seats killed it off big time for me. To me both these faults had nothing whatsoever to do with it being a hand built car, just poor development prior to release.

I had my doubts at first such that I ended up with a 22MY car. To answer your three points:
1. If by soundtrack you mean a V8 versus anything then I would have to agree. My Roadster with AR exhaust sounded pretty good but obviously not a V8. I have the standard exhaust which pops and burbles in Sport and Sport+. If I had the choice again I would probably go for the switchable/valved system. If by soundtrack you mean the bluetooth then I could probably blow the doors off with mine as Headless Blue will confirm.
2. Touch every piece of wood and cross every finger but as yet I have had no problems with the radiators on mine. There is probably a pool forming on my garage floor as I write this
3. I have the Comfort seats which as it says on the tin are very comfortable. Having subsequently sat in a Plus Six with Comfort Plus I would probably go for them as they are even better.

Having said that as we all know MMC are serial offenders when it comes to releasing cars that are not properly designed, tested, etc.

On that note, everything has gone VERY quiet on the Super 3 front. Does anybody have any news?


John R Marchant
Plus Four JT10MOG "Florence"
Re: Radiator fix [Re: JJR] #739554
20/04/22 03:12 PM
20/04/22 03:12 PM
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Devonshire
+8Rich Offline
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Originally Posted by JJR
Originally Posted by +8Rich
Originally Posted by CooperMan
Originally Posted by +8Rich
Yes Jon, that's what these boys said as per dealers advise..

So, as I see it a WET system that becomes hydraulically locked by it's OE design...and blows things apart... doh

I'll go with that but surely this should have been remedied during the road testing period, I find it hard to believe MMC were not fully aware of these problems prior to releasing the cars to the public - again nono


The times I have counted my blessings by staying with the Plus 8 and not changed to a Plus Four you wouldn't believe.

My good lady suggested I got a new car last year bless her and I did a lot of homework but the sound track and faulty radiators and uncomfortable seats killed it off big time for me. To me both these faults had nothing whatsoever to do with it being a hand built car, just poor development prior to release.

I had my doubts at first such that I ended up with a 22MY car. To answer your three points:
1. If by soundtrack you mean a V8 versus anything then I would have to agree. My Roadster with AR exhaust sounded pretty good but obviously not a V8. I have the standard exhaust which pops and burbles in Sport and Sport+. If I had the choice again I would probably go for the switchable/valved system. If by soundtrack you mean the bluetooth then I could probably blow the doors off with mine as Headless Blue will confirm.
2. Touch every piece of wood and cross every finger but as yet I have had no problems with the radiators on mine. There is probably a pool forming on my garage floor as I write this
3. I have the Comfort seats which as it says on the tin are very comfortable. Having subsequently sat in a Plus Six with Comfort Plus I would probably go for them as they are even better.

Having said that as we all know MMC are serial offenders when it comes to releasing cars that are not properly designed, tested, etc.

On that note, everything has gone VERY quiet on the Super 3 front. Does anybody have any news?

Thank you John, I am really pleased for you that your car has behaved well.
By sound track I was comparing the V8 as opposed to the in car entertainment, my Plus 8 came with a Becker set up which I only turn on when I'm fiddling in the garage.
It seems crazy to me that you can release a car onto the market with uncomfortable seats and that you have to in effect have not one but a second upgrade in an 80k car.

Who knows I might get one sometime in the future when the LHD knee finally gives out and I can no longer do my own maintenance etc, I'm happy in a holding position right now. Exhaust upgrade noted..

I appreciate your explanations though John, thanks for taking the time and enjoy this lovely spring time weather.


Regards Richard

1999 Indigo Blue +8
2009 4/4 Sport Green prev
1993 Connaught Green +8 prev





Re: Radiator fix [Re: John V6] #739555
20/04/22 03:29 PM
20/04/22 03:29 PM
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John V6 Offline OP
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i was as they say asking for a friend who picks up a used plus four at the weekend. Thanks for the replies


JohnV6
2014 Brooklands Edition Roadster "Brookland's Belle" #5 of 50
Re: Radiator fix [Re: John V6] #739569
20/04/22 03:48 PM
20/04/22 03:48 PM
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Last time i went to garage Albert was to take a picture of radiator leaking again.

They put the new radiator cap and untill now the leak has not increased.

Only one small drop on the garage floor.

If this is the solution , they have lost a lot of money changing

Dozen of radiators.

Re: Radiator fix [Re: John V6] #739574
20/04/22 04:17 PM
20/04/22 04:17 PM
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The revised radiator mounting, along with the lower pressure cap, and reduced coolant level has not prevented any further radiator failures

I’ve been contacted by a dealer , who having fitted a third replacement radiator on a Plus Six in year, had the third radiator last less than 80 miles….

I’ll be working on a solution soon….


Simon @ Sifab.co.uk

Sifabtemporary@gmail.com
Re: Radiator fix [Re: John V6] #740484
29/04/22 06:27 PM
29/04/22 06:27 PM
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I changed my leaky radiator
With replacement, new cap and 50% full fluid
I have done 2500 kms since, without problem ... for the moment ...


Fun is not a straight line ...
Re: Radiator fix [Re: SimonH] #740538
30/04/22 11:00 AM
30/04/22 11:00 AM
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East Harling, Norfolk UK
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Originally Posted by SimonH
The revised radiator mounting, along with the lower pressure cap, and reduced coolant level has not prevented any further radiator failures

I’ve been contacted by a dealer , who having fitted a third replacement radiator on a Plus Six in year, had the third radiator last less than 80 miles….

I’ll be working on a solution soon….

Not a minute too soon by the sound of it Simon. You will have a strong market for such I'm sure.

FWIW it's taken me a couple of months and a 1000 miles to completely cure minor hose leaks on my Roadster which despite nipping up hose clips when hot, kept re-appearing and in differing locations including T piece, top and bottom hose. Finally cured by extra hose clips on the lower two of bottom hose connections and ensuring coolant filled to no higher than mid mark on header tank.


Richard

2018 Roadster - Red/Magnolia - "Morton"
1966 Land Rover series 2a SWB
1945 Moto Guzzi Airone
Re: Radiator fix [Re: John V6] #740539
30/04/22 11:09 AM
30/04/22 11:09 AM
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John V6 Offline OP
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Lets hope so Richard I know Hawki's new to him plus four has had 4 rads in 18 months.


JohnV6
2014 Brooklands Edition Roadster "Brookland's Belle" #5 of 50
Re: Radiator fix [Re: John V6] #742868
26/05/22 07:34 AM
26/05/22 07:34 AM
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I had a major leak on my radiator which was very efficiently replaced by Adam at MelvynRutter (under warranty) - this seems to have fixed the leaking.

To answer John V6’s question about the engine coolant cap being changed - attached are some photos - the original cap has a red “Stant” printed on it, the new cap has no such printed text. When the cap is replaced the header tank is drained and refilled with 500ml of coolant (and a sticker applied to the side of the tank).

No idea if these two things will permanently fix the radiator blowing again, but I hope they will!

Old cap as installed (note there is a second similar tank and cap, just visible under hood - that is the aircon coolant):
[Linked Image]

New cap:
[Linked Image]
[Linked Image]

New cap and sticker installed:
[Linked Image]

Re: Radiator fix [Re: John V6] #742870
26/05/22 08:10 AM
26/05/22 08:10 AM
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Strangely , after i had again a leak with le third radiator and the new cap , no drops on the garage floor even i have made two times 350 km .

Re: Radiator fix [Re: Gonze] #742877
26/05/22 08:53 AM
26/05/22 08:53 AM
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Originally Posted by Gonze
I had a major leak on my radiator which was very efficiently replaced by Adam at MelvynRutter (under warranty) - this seems to have fixed the leaking.

To answer John V6’s question about the engine coolant cap being changed - attached are some photos - the original cap has a red “Stant” printed on it, the new cap has no such printed text. When the cap is replaced the header tank is drained and refilled with 500ml of coolant (and a sticker applied to the side of the tank).

No idea if these two things will permanently fix the radiator blowing again, but I hope they will!

Old cap as installed (note there is a second similar tank and cap, just visible under hood - that is the aircon coolant):
[Linked Image]

New cap:
[Linked Image]
[Linked Image]

New cap and sticker installed:
[Linked Image]


The second tank is for the chargecooler not aircon


Simon @ Sifab.co.uk

Sifabtemporary@gmail.com
Re: Radiator fix [Re: John V6] #742878
26/05/22 08:59 AM
26/05/22 08:59 AM
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I'm intrigued by this discussion (although I don't have a problem with my Roadster radiator as far as I know), because I have previously owned TVRs which featured a "swirl tank" (or "swirl pot"). This article explains: https://www.merlinmotorsport.co.uk/...system-header-tanks-in-your-race-car-323
I recall there was some discussion among TVR owners as to which of the caps should be "pressure relief" type, and which simply plain. In my last TVR, an S3, also with a Ford V6 (2.9) engine, I had a swirl pot with a pressure-cap above the thermostat. The overflow just had a cap, as the level never reached more than about half. This is probably all basic stuff for somebody who knows more than me about Morgan cooling systems, and will probably be able to explain which of our cars if any have swirl pots.
[Linked Image]


Peter
2009 3-litre Roadster "Ivor", royal ivory / green
Re: Radiator fix [Re: CooperMan] #742884
26/05/22 09:34 AM
26/05/22 09:34 AM
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East Harling, Norfolk UK
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Originally Posted by CooperMan
Originally Posted by +8Rich
Yes Jon, that's what these boys said as per dealers advise..

So, as I see it a WET system that becomes hydraulically locked by it's OE design...and blows things apart... doh

I don't see it as a hydraulic lock situation Jon. The coolant vapour pressure above the level in the header tank reflects back through the incompressible coolant to pressurise the radiator. Increasing this vapour volume with lower coolant level and futher controling it's pressure with release cap was supposedly the radiator fix. I understand CX rads have still failed after this though thinking


Richard

2018 Roadster - Red/Magnolia - "Morton"
1966 Land Rover series 2a SWB
1945 Moto Guzzi Airone
Re: Radiator fix [Re: John V6] #742908
26/05/22 03:04 PM
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France, Dunkerque
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I wonder if it is not a quality problem of the radiators. Mine at 12,000 km.

We changed the cap and checked the level at 8000 KM. We drove around Spain with a temperature of 35°C and not a drop under the car.

Uneven manufacturing quality may be the explanation.

Re: Radiator fix [Re: John V6] #749779
29/07/22 10:54 AM
29/07/22 10:54 AM
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France, Dunkerque
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Can someone explain how a swirl pot works?
What are the effects on the radiator?
Do the Z4s have this type of equipment?

Re: Radiator fix [Re: gaston] #749780
29/07/22 11:02 AM
29/07/22 11:02 AM
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Devonshire
+8Rich Offline
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Originally Posted by gaston
Can someone explain how a swirl pot works?
What are the effects on the radiator?
Do the Z4s have this type of equipment?

Gaston - Richard explains a little on this post - it was all new to me also..Swirl pot..

Good luck getting your car rectified.


Regards Richard

1999 Indigo Blue +8
2009 4/4 Sport Green prev
1993 Connaught Green +8 prev





Re: Radiator fix [Re: gaston] #749788
29/07/22 11:56 AM
29/07/22 11:56 AM
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East Harling, Norfolk UK
RichardV6 Offline
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Originally Posted by gaston
Can someone explain how a swirl pot works?
What are the effects on the radiator?
Do the Z4s have this type of equipment?

Scroll down this page for general description of swirl pot/tank function.


Richard

2018 Roadster - Red/Magnolia - "Morton"
1966 Land Rover series 2a SWB
1945 Moto Guzzi Airone
Re: Radiator fix [Re: John V6] #749790
29/07/22 12:32 PM
29/07/22 12:32 PM
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East Harling, Norfolk UK
RichardV6 Offline
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My own thoughts which are just that, is that the unique fit, coolant plumbing and components of same on BMW's well proven B48 variant collectively cause the issue. Maybe under sudden load, steam is allowed to form probably in the integral to head exhaust manifold. When the thermostat in the radiator return fully opens, such steam pockets enter top of rad and cause mechanical shock from the thermal shock due to sudden cooling.

Cars driven on the track where stat is open most of the time or at the other extreme when gently driven will likely never experience this issue, explaining why not all rads fail and wasn't noticed in original testing.

Certainly mechanical shock in plumbing is well demonstrated at home when a tap is turned off suddenly and a poorly supported copper pipe rattles or bangs, which can turn to leaks at any adjacent joint over time.


Richard

2018 Roadster - Red/Magnolia - "Morton"
1966 Land Rover series 2a SWB
1945 Moto Guzzi Airone
Re: Radiator fix [Re: John V6] #749798
29/07/22 02:26 PM
29/07/22 02:26 PM
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John V6 Offline OP
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I too think it is thermal shock / pipe hammer. The earlier fix of lowering both the coolant header tank level and the pressure the cap blows at means there is more air that compresses easily to dampen any hammer & in the worst case vent gas.

In industry pneumatic dampers are quite common to stop pipe hammer caused by say a valve closure on a circuit.


JohnV6
2014 Brooklands Edition Roadster "Brookland's Belle" #5 of 50
Re: Radiator fix [Re: John V6] #749799
29/07/22 02:28 PM
29/07/22 02:28 PM
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I dont buy thermal shock cracking welds

My thoughts are that the top 6" of the radiator are completely unsupported- and MMC's fix to date has been to increasingly stiffen the mountings hence the welds cracking...

Also the Header tank is too small to accomodate for coolant expansion. I bet that during testing the cars kept spitting out coolant- hence they were delivered with a 25 odd lb radiator cap to try and keep the coolant in....


Simon @ Sifab.co.uk

Sifabtemporary@gmail.com
Re: Radiator fix [Re: John V6] #749800
29/07/22 02:30 PM
29/07/22 02:30 PM
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France, Dunkerque
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gaston Offline
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Thank you for your feedback.

Re: Radiator fix [Re: SimonH] #749801
29/07/22 02:44 PM
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John V6 Offline OP
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Originally Posted by SimonH
I dont buy thermal shock cracking welds
My thoughts are that the top 6" of the radiator are completely unsupported- and MMC's fix to date has been to increasingly stiffen the mountings. Also the Header tank is to small to accomodate for coolant expansion. I bet that during testing the cars kept spitting out coolant- hence they were delivered with a 25 odd lb radiator cap to try and keep the coolant in....


Simon I agree the tanks are very small indeed. Lets hope they find the solution


JohnV6
2014 Brooklands Edition Roadster "Brookland's Belle" #5 of 50
Re: Radiator fix [Re: John V6] #749802
29/07/22 02:54 PM
29/07/22 02:54 PM
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Originally Posted by John V6
Originally Posted by SimonH
I dont buy thermal shock cracking welds
My thoughts are that the top 6" of the radiator are completely unsupported- and MMC's fix to date has been to increasingly stiffen the mountings. Also the Header tank is to small to accomodate for coolant expansion. I bet that during testing the cars kept spitting out coolant- hence they were delivered with a 25 odd lb radiator cap to try and keep the coolant in....


Simon I agree the tanks are very small indeed. Lets hope they find the solution


Perhaps they should pay me consultancy.....


Simon @ Sifab.co.uk

Sifabtemporary@gmail.com
Re: Radiator fix [Re: John V6] #749803
29/07/22 03:30 PM
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Originally Posted by SimonH
Originally Posted by John V6
Originally Posted by SimonH
I dont buy thermal shock cracking welds
My thoughts are that the top 6" of the radiator are completely unsupported- and MMC's fix to date has been to increasingly stiffen the mountings. Also the Header tank is to small to accomodate for coolant expansion. I bet that during testing the cars kept spitting out coolant- hence they were delivered with a 25 odd lb radiator cap to try and keep the coolant in....


Simon I agree the tanks are very small indeed. Lets hope they find the solution


Perhaps they should pay me consultancy.....


I can perhaps advance them the money to be definitely quiet. innocent

Re: Radiator fix [Re: John V6] #749903
30/07/22 01:29 PM
30/07/22 01:29 PM
Joined: Aug 2021
Posts: 81
West Somerset
Davetherave Offline
Just Getting Started
Davetherave  Offline
Just Getting Started

Joined: Aug 2021
Posts: 81
West Somerset
I have moved my following comments from the "brake failure" area to this post as its more applicable..


My questions to Morgan would be ( Engineering hat back on ).

AA: Are ALL the CX vehicles going to be fitted with a swirl pot to prevent thermal shock, if so, when/how?.. If its just specific vehicles to have the swirl pot, why.? Where is the information/notification for this work.

BB: Have the BMW vehicles fitted with the engines that Morgan use experienced similar radiator thermal shock issues, or is the Morgan cooling configuration vastly different.?

If as reported the Morgan factory are gearing up for the radiator work ( recall?? ), where is the information from Morgan... Surely they should be issuing notification to CX owners. How will this impact warranty for CX cars coming to the end of their factory warranty period.


There were no replies to the above post, when posted in the brake failure thread ( following other like posts ) . So I guess no one at the MMC are willing to comment or any dealer openly comment (and they must look at this forum)... I am about to complete the purchase of a MY 2020 Plus 6, which looks and drives beautifully, the dealer has been great so far. But I am now having second thoughts about the purchase ref the lack of information being given out by the MMC on the radiator mods and now the comments being made ref the suspension spring issues. It may be better to lose my deposit and keep my Trad Morgan, with this vehicle I have already fixed the problems with an alloy radiator and new rear leaf springs... I do not want to have to go through all this again on the Plus 6.

Last edited by Davetherave; 30/07/22 01:31 PM.

Dave
Plus 6.
Roadster departed.
1936 BSA Empire Star Q8. 1935 BSA W7-35. 1938 BSA M20
Re: Radiator fix [Re: Davetherave] #749908
30/07/22 01:48 PM
30/07/22 01:48 PM
Joined: Nov 2015
Posts: 5,100
Northern Capital of Cool
CooperMan Offline
Just barreling along
CooperMan  Offline
Just barreling along
Charter Member

Joined: Nov 2015
Posts: 5,100
Northern Capital of Cool
Originally Posted by Davetherave
I have moved my following comments from the "brake failure" area to this post as its more applicable..

There were no replies to the above post, when posted in the brake failure thread ( following other like posts ) . So I guess no one at the MMC are willing to comment or any dealer openly comment (and they must look at this forum)... I am about to complete the purchase of a MY 2020 Plus 6, which looks and drives beautifully, the dealer has been great so far. But I am now having second thoughts about the purchase ref the lack of information being given out by the MMC on the radiator mods and now the comments being made ref the suspension spring issues. It may be better to lose my deposit and keep my Trad Morgan, with this vehicle I have already fixed the problems with an alloy radiator and new rear leaf springs... I do not want to have to go through all this again on the Plus 6.

I know what my decision would be, having also taken a couple of years to fine tune a Roadster, CX with warranty about to end...potential money pit & unusable downtime, complex mechanical & electrical dealer only fixes, and I suspect poor residual values ?


Jon M
Re: Radiator fix [Re: John V6] #749909
30/07/22 01:48 PM
30/07/22 01:48 PM
Joined: Jul 2022
Posts: 18
Chester
Mikemog6 Offline
New to Talk Morgan
Mikemog6  Offline
New to Talk Morgan

Joined: Jul 2022
Posts: 18
Chester
I am sure there are legal types on this forum, bit is not the dealer in breach of contract for falling to supply?


Previous Mog Plus 4 Fiat Twin Cam.
Plus Six on order.
Re: Radiator fix [Re: Davetherave] #749948
30/07/22 07:27 PM
30/07/22 07:27 PM
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 5,411
Australia - NSW North Coast
OZ 4/4 Online content
Charter Member
OZ 4/4  Online Content
Charter Member

Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 5,411
Australia - NSW North Coast
Originally Posted by Davetherave
I have moved my following comments from the "brake failure" area to this post as its more applicable..


My questions to Morgan would be ( Engineering hat back on ).

AA: Are ALL the CX vehicles going to be fitted with a swirl pot to prevent thermal shock, if so, when/how?.. If its just specific vehicles to have the swirl pot, why.? Where is the information/notification for this work.

BB: Have the BMW vehicles fitted with the engines that Morgan use experienced similar radiator thermal shock issues, or is the Morgan cooling configuration vastly different.?

If as reported the Morgan factory are gearing up for the radiator work ( recall?? ), where is the information from Morgan... Surely they should be issuing notification to CX owners. How will this impact warranty for CX cars coming to the end of their factory warranty period.


There were no replies to the above post, when posted in the brake failure thread ( following other like posts ) . So I guess no one at the MMC are willing to comment or any dealer openly comment (and they must look at this forum)... I am about to complete the purchase of a MY 2020 Plus 6, which looks and drives beautifully, the dealer has been great so far. But I am now having second thoughts about the purchase ref the lack of information being given out by the MMC on the radiator mods and now the comments being made ref the suspension spring issues. It may be better to lose my deposit and keep my Trad Morgan, with this vehicle I have already fixed the problems with an alloy radiator and new rear leaf springs... I do not want to have to go through all this again on the Plus 6.

So sad to read this Dave but I understand what you're going through......

Last edited by OZ 4/4; 30/07/22 07:28 PM.

A Morgan Identified Fastidious Owner...
2011 4/4 Bespoke, 1981 Delorean, Auburn Boat Tail
Re: Radiator fix [Re: John V6] #749988
31/07/22 07:20 AM
31/07/22 07:20 AM
Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 258
Nr Watership Down UK
J
JMD Offline
Learner Plates Off!
JMD  Offline
Learner Plates Off!
J

Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 258
Nr Watership Down UK
Car cooling systems are vastly more complex these days - besides huge heat surges from the turbo, fancy warm up cycles, engine/gearbox oil cooling etc, a lot of manufacturers cite the way their engines are slow to cool after shut down so that if they are restarted after a short or medium period (0.5-4 hours?) the engine is still warm enough to give immediately good emissions and fuel efficiency performance....not the case with a "cold" start

The packaging in the Morgan application is very different to BMW so it is likely the cooling systems in the Plus Four/Six will not have had the same level of detailed development....

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