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Fuel Tank size #741705
12/05/22 01:22 PM
12/05/22 01:22 PM
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God's own county
Sir Percival Offline OP
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Tried a little test on our new Plus Four. The handbook says the tank holds 43 litres and that a warning light will come on when approximately 6 litres remain. We carried on for another 40 miles after this point, approx 4.5 litres, which meant we should have 1.5 litres left. The gauge was now right on the empty mark and we dare not go any further as there is a warning in the handbook to not let the vehicle run completely out of fuel as this may damage the engine and other components.

We thought we must have been running on fresh air at this point and were somewhat baffled when we pulled into a service station and only managed to squeeze in 31.03 litres rather than the 41.5 litres we were expecting.

Is the size of the tank overstated or do we have a duff one?

Sir P

Re: Fuel Tank size [Re: Sir Percival] #741707
12/05/22 01:44 PM
12/05/22 01:44 PM
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Morgan fuel gages are at best vague....

Ive measured a +4 tank at 43 Litres...


Simon @ Sifab.co.uk

Sifabtemporary@gmail.com
Re: Fuel Tank size [Re: Sir Percival] #741711
12/05/22 02:45 PM
12/05/22 02:45 PM
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Suffolk
John V6 Offline
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They all do that sir. My Roadster gauge is useless. I use the oddometer to judge when to fill


JohnV6
2014 Brooklands Edition Roadster "Brookland's Belle" #5 of 50
Re: Fuel Tank size [Re: Sir Percival] #741712
12/05/22 02:47 PM
12/05/22 02:47 PM
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Lytham St Annes, Lancashire
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Whilst you might not have been able to fill it up as much as you estimated, you car is probably doing more MPG than you first thought. I find my fuel gauge can drop suddenly within a few miles, then as soon as I find a constant speed it rises again. At best the fuel gauge is an indication of some petrol in the tank, often beyond that hopeful note of optimism , I tend to rely more on the miles travelled since last fill up and my conservation MPG estimate as my more reliable gauge of remaining fuel, as I don't need the onset of remaining range anxiety.


John
2008 Roadster 4 seater FELIX
prev 2006 4/4 70th LOKI
prev 1977 4/4 SEAMUS
prev 1985 4/4 MOLLY
Re: Fuel Tank size [Re: JohnHarris] #741713
12/05/22 03:11 PM
12/05/22 03:11 PM
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God's own county
Sir Percival Offline OP
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On that particular test we had done 280 miles and used 31.03 litres (= 6.83 gallons) which equates to 41.02mpg

If as you say the fuel gauge is somewhat iffy that would mean I could have gone for a further 100 miles (43litres = 9.46 gallons @ 40 mpg = 380 miles).

Would you have carried on with the fuel warning light flashing and the fuel gauge showing empty for a further 100 miles. Surely the fuel gauge can't be that far out.

Interestingly on our previous Morgan a 3.7 Roadster the fuel gauge and miles left indicator were extremely accurate, I would have trusted them with my life!

Re: Fuel Tank size [Re: John V6] #741718
12/05/22 04:32 PM
12/05/22 04:32 PM
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God's own county
Sir Percival Offline OP
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Originally Posted by John V6
They all do that sir. My Roadster gauge is useless. I use the oddometer to judge when to fill


Which is fine if you know how much the tank holds, that's what I am trying to find out smile

Re: Fuel Tank size [Re: Sir Percival] #741719
12/05/22 04:41 PM
12/05/22 04:41 PM
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Suffolk
John V6 Offline
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I thought you just did or did you not note the mileage? I just fill every 200-220 miles as the avg mpg is around 29. Yours should be far higher of course.

I guess you are after the real end mileage possible, I just don't take the risk and start looking after 200 miles.


JohnV6
2014 Brooklands Edition Roadster "Brookland's Belle" #5 of 50
Re: Fuel Tank size [Re: Sir Percival] #741724
12/05/22 05:58 PM
12/05/22 05:58 PM
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Devonshire
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I do as John does and fill up at 200 miles knowing I probably have another 50 miles in hand at 23mpg with my 1999 Plus 8 - as the fuel tanks appear to vary if you really must know the capacity fill it up and pump it out using a small 12 volt pump and 5 gallon drums it will be the only way to know.

Most of us run on the odometer method I think you'll find.


Regards Richard

1999 Indigo Blue +8
2009 4/4 Sport Green prev
1993 Connaught Green +8 prev





Re: Fuel Tank size [Re: Sir Percival] #741725
12/05/22 06:04 PM
12/05/22 06:04 PM
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Northern Capital of Cool
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Take out the spare wheel, accurately measure the tank and cube up it's volume, however as some have found you can't always get a Morgan tank properly full due to venting issues as you pump petrol in


Jon M
Re: Fuel Tank size [Re: CooperMan] #741726
12/05/22 06:06 PM
12/05/22 06:06 PM
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Devonshire
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If he has one Jon... Plus Four..


Regards Richard

1999 Indigo Blue +8
2009 4/4 Sport Green prev
1993 Connaught Green +8 prev





Re: Fuel Tank size [Re: +8Rich] #741728
12/05/22 06:16 PM
12/05/22 06:16 PM
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Northern Capital of Cool
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Originally Posted by +8Rich
If he has one Jon... Plus Four..

Cue thread drift 'to spare or not to spare' laugh2


Jon M
Re: Fuel Tank size [Re: Sir Percival] #741731
12/05/22 06:38 PM
12/05/22 06:38 PM
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Shrewsbury
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I do about 300 miles poodling along, but if I’m on the motorway and enjoying my self in the Plus Four, I look for petrol at 250 miles.


Heron Grey Plus Four 2021

Previous:-
Connaught Green 4/4 1988
Black Plus 8 1998
Re: Fuel Tank size [Re: Sir Percival] #741734
12/05/22 07:03 PM
12/05/22 07:03 PM
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Suffolk
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I know if patient I can 4l plus by filling v slowly


JohnV6
2014 Brooklands Edition Roadster "Brookland's Belle" #5 of 50
Re: Fuel Tank size [Re: Sir Percival] #741743
12/05/22 08:26 PM
12/05/22 08:26 PM
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Belgium
MATTMOG Online content
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Well; coincidentally I had a problem with the fuel gauge in two-ton the past few weeks.
Always indicated completely full. He did that sometimes in the past, but after a while or a refill everything went back to normal.
But not anymore, Research was needed.
I found in this great forum that the cause could be the tank sensor and how to clean it.
The spare wheel and everything else off.
Disconnected the cables to the sender and the gauge gave zero.
Then the resistance measured on the sender, which gave 38 ohms which according to Bunny's data is about half full.
But how much is in the tank now?
It's pretty simple to figure that out on an old Morgan. No valve in the filler opening.
I took a cord with a thick nut on it and lower it to the bottom.
I could see that the tank was indeed half full. So the sender is ok.
The contacts of the sender and cables cleaned and reattached and everything worked as usual.
Refueled up to three quarters with the gauge on, and double check with the cord,everything fine.
Did 120 Km today and everything is back to normal.
Apparently it was just a bad contact. But to measure is to know as we say in Flemish.

What would we be doing all day without a Morgan!?!? innocent


Paul

1990 4/4 1.6 Ford CVH
2014 +4 2.0 Ford
2005 BMW Z4 2.2 6Cyl
Re: Fuel Tank size [Re: Sir Percival] #741750
12/05/22 09:43 PM
12/05/22 09:43 PM
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Posts: 95
Northants
JJR Offline
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This thread seems to have drifted off the original topic which is how much fuel does the tank in the CX Plus Four hold. What the size of tank or MPG of a Plus 8 or Roadster may be is entirely irrelevant save for being further examples of how inaccurate fuel tank/mileage readings are in Morgans. This is a good question which one would imagine would be simple to answer. Sadly that is not the case. I will have to look back through some of my earlier posts on this subject but I seem to remember that the useable capacity of the tank is about eight litres less than the nominal size of the tank. In other words there are about eight litres of fuel in the tank that the fuel pickup cannot access. Depending upon how I drive I get between 30mpg and 50mpg so an average of 40 mpg. I fill up when I am approaching 200 miles on the odometer and would advise any other Plus Four user to do the same.


John R Marchant
Plus Four JT10MOG "Florence"
Re: Fuel Tank size [Re: SimonH] #741764
13/05/22 07:37 AM
13/05/22 07:37 AM
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East Harling, Norfolk UK
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Originally Posted by SimonH
Morgan fuel gages are at best vague....

Ive measured a +4 tank at 43 Litres...

But not all! Have taken my Roadster down to "10 miles to Empty" with gauge just showing empty. It took nearly 50 litres. Close enough to spot on for a 52 litre tank.

As I've suggested before probably a Friday afternoon job innocent


Richard

2018 Roadster - Red/Magnolia - "Morton"
1966 Land Rover series 2a SWB
1945 Moto Guzzi Airone
Re: Fuel Tank size [Re: RichardV6] #741773
13/05/22 08:38 AM
13/05/22 08:38 AM
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Originally Posted by RichardV6
Originally Posted by SimonH
Morgan fuel gages are at best vague....

Ive measured a +4 tank at 43 Litres...

But not all! Have taken my Roadster down to "10 miles to Empty" with gauge just showing empty. It took nearly 50 litres. Close enough to spot on for a 52 litre tank.

As I've suggested before probably a Friday afternoon job innocent


There are over 50 variations of trad Morgan fuel tank…

But I have measured a CX PLUS 4 tank at 43 ltrs…
The factory wanted me to make larger ones for the race cars


Simon @ Sifab.co.uk

Sifabtemporary@gmail.com
Re: Fuel Tank size [Re: Sir Percival] #741788
13/05/22 11:31 AM
13/05/22 11:31 AM
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Posts: 412
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thierry242 Offline
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28 litres for 405 km. orange light was on

Re: Fuel Tank size [Re: Sir Percival] #741803
13/05/22 03:04 PM
13/05/22 03:04 PM
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Lampeter, Wales
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43 litres is over 9 gallons, which should last 360 miles at 40mpg. So you could wait for 300 miles before filling up.

Re: Fuel Tank size [Re: Jon G4LJW] #741822
13/05/22 04:43 PM
13/05/22 04:43 PM
Joined: Apr 2012
Posts: 94
God's own county
Sir Percival Offline OP
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Originally Posted by Jon G4LJW
43 litres is over 9 gallons, which should last 360 miles at 40mpg. So you could wait for 300 miles before filling up.


Thats the big IF though Jon.
If there is in fact 43 litres in the tank and all those litres are accessible!

The reason I asked this question was because of a pending trip around Europe, it makes a big difference if you know you have 300 miles in the tank instead of 200 on a long journey.

Sir P

Re: Fuel Tank size [Re: Sir Percival] #741825
13/05/22 04:59 PM
13/05/22 04:59 PM
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Devonshire
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Tricky Dicky
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This from Almond in 2021 commenting on his Plus Four. Here he posted it in October 2021....

"I raised this same fuel gauge issue some time ago with MMC through my dealer. Their reply seems to be Morgan speak for 'put up with it'.

Amongst a number of problems with my Plus Four (now mostly sorted but some still ongoing) my comments on the fuel gauge were as follows

My comments " Fuel gauge and low level warning light calibration clearly needs some work. Last weekend the low level light came on when the gauge was reading exactly 50% full. Exactly 11 miles later when I stopped for fuel the gauge read 25%. I could then only get 26.75l of fuel in the tank. Needless to say both gauge and the warning light are currently close to no use and need sorting"

MMC's reply was, and I quote "The total amount of fuel that is USABLE in the tank is 33 litres. The actual gauge reading is 27litres From full to empty. There is 5 litres above the float when the tank reads full. This is why it takes a while for the gauge to start to read. Once it starts to read you have 27 litres left. The low fuel light comes on when there is 6 litres remaining. Once the gauge hits the bottom red the tank will only be able to take 33 litres. There is fuel in the bottom of the tank, but this is not useable".

It certainly wouldn't be acceptable on a normal car but in Morgan's view of the world it clearly is justifiable ...

So it looks like you have
- a 38 litre tank according to the Plus Four handbook.
- of that 38 litres only 33 litres are usable (according to Morrgan's reply to me).
- The sender is then calibrated to illuminate the level warning light when you have 6 litres of the 33 litres left.
- meaning you can only use about 27 litres before the light comes on.

That 27 litres correlates with my experience and I have only ever managed to get 28 litres in afetr teh light had been on for a bit. Currently if I am driving normally I aim for fuel every 250 miles. As Spanner Juggler indicates the odometer is still the best gauge in a Morgan.

On a more positive note fuel consumption is pretty good. Mine is an automatic and normally gives 42/44 mpg in mixed driving going with the traffic flow. Although a couple of weeks ago on the Isle of Man for the Motoring Festival it averaged 26 mpg on one tank in Sport+ mode on the unrestricted roads."


Regards Richard

1999 Indigo Blue +8
2009 4/4 Sport Green prev
1993 Connaught Green +8 prev





Re: Fuel Tank size [Re: Sir Percival] #741826
13/05/22 05:22 PM
13/05/22 05:22 PM
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God's own county
Sir Percival Offline OP
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Thanks very much for this Richard.

Ties in with my findings and answers the question. Bit of a bugger really but, hey ho, it's a Morgan - what do you expect!

Re: Fuel Tank size [Re: Sir Percival] #741827
13/05/22 05:32 PM
13/05/22 05:32 PM
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Devonshire
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You are welcome and I wish you a great trip into Europe - we'll be waiting on some pictures thumbs

It does seem really crazy that the best any of us can say wrt any model Morgan is that 200 miles range for safety sake.. doh as you rightly say it's what we have bought into warts an all.. it's a good job they are a joy to drive smile


Regards Richard

1999 Indigo Blue +8
2009 4/4 Sport Green prev
1993 Connaught Green +8 prev





Re: Fuel Tank size [Re: Sir Percival] #741828
13/05/22 06:19 PM
13/05/22 06:19 PM
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Austria, Vienna area
The Austrian Offline
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I would carry a spare canister as long as the tank capacity remains unclear.
Drive till the tank gets empty and use the spare petrol for the trip to the next fuel station. Fill up the tank.
The receipt will tell you the available tank volume. ( a bit of clever mathematical calculations on gas milage for the distance of dry tank to the petrol station can be added to get the perfect result )


Hannes
once: Green M3W; 2013
now: Red 4/4 Sport; 2011
and some practical cars for use in real life
Re: Fuel Tank size [Re: Sir Percival] #742135
17/05/22 11:27 AM
17/05/22 11:27 AM
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Cambs., UK
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Thanks for finding my earlier post Richard. I have been snowed under in the office and hadn't had chance to dig it out.

It strikes me that if SimonH is correct with the CX having an actual capacity of 43l, I have actually got 16l left in the tank when the gauge reads empty and the warning light is on (Never been able to get more than 27/28l in). Nice to know that Morgan are looking after me and want me always carry around that 16litres/12kg of fuel that I can't use in a light-weight sports car confused


Ian

A convert to the joy of Morgans after years of motorcycles
Re: Fuel Tank size [Re: Almond] #742136
17/05/22 11:46 AM
17/05/22 11:46 AM
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Northants, UK
TBM Offline
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Originally Posted by Almond
Nice to know that Morgan are looking after me and want me always carry around that 16litres/12kg of fuel that I can't use in a light-weight sports car confused


Doesn't mean you can't use it, just you have to be confident about how far you can get on 16litres..... (I would have thought at least 100miles allowing for a bit of unusable volume at the bottom of the fuel pick up)

On older vehicles, you can alter (bend) the float arm to make the reading more accurate - not sure if possible with a more modern car.


1972 4/4 4 seater - 3G Morganeer
Too many ratty motorbikes
Re: Fuel Tank size [Re: Almond] #742137
17/05/22 11:57 AM
17/05/22 11:57 AM
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Lampeter, Wales
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Originally Posted by Almond
Thanks for finding my earlier post Richard. I have been snowed under in the office and hadn't had chance to dig it out.

It strikes me that if SimonH is correct with the CX having an actual capacity of 43l, I have actually got 16l left in the tank when the gauge reads empty and the warning light is on (Never been able to get more than 27/28l in). Nice to know that Morgan are looking after me and want me always carry around that 16litres/12kg of fuel that I can't use in a light-weight sports car confused


You do have 6 litres available when the warning light comes on. That’s about 1.3 Imperial gallons, so presumably would get you another 40 miles or so….

Re: Fuel Tank size [Re: TBM] #742138
17/05/22 12:02 PM
17/05/22 12:02 PM
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Originally Posted by TBM
Originally Posted by Almond
Nice to know that Morgan are looking after me and want me always carry around that 16litres/12kg of fuel that I can't use in a light-weight sports car confused


Doesn't mean you can't use it, just you have to be confident about how far you can get on 16litres..... (I would have thought at least 100miles allowing for a bit of unusable volume at the bottom of the fuel pick up)

On older vehicles, you can alter (bend) the float arm to make the reading more accurate - not sure if possible with a more modern car.


The fuel pump wont actually pick up the last 16 litres......
ooo


Simon @ Sifab.co.uk

Sifabtemporary@gmail.com
Re: Fuel Tank size [Re: SimonH] #742140
17/05/22 12:24 PM
17/05/22 12:24 PM
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Northants, UK
TBM Offline
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Originally Posted by SimonH


The fuel pump wont actually pick up the last 16 litres......
ooo


Ah, that is shite. smile


1972 4/4 4 seater - 3G Morganeer
Too many ratty motorbikes
Re: Fuel Tank size [Re: Almond] #742141
17/05/22 12:30 PM
17/05/22 12:30 PM
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Devonshire
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Originally Posted by Almond
Thanks for finding my earlier post Richard. I have been snowed under in the office and hadn't had chance to dig it out.

It strikes me that if SimonH is correct with the CX having an actual capacity of 43l, I have actually got 16l left in the tank when the gauge reads empty and the warning light is on (Never been able to get more than 27/28l in). Nice to know that Morgan are looking after me and want me always carry around that 16litres/12kg of fuel that I can't use in a light-weight sports car confused

Ian, it does seem damn crazy to be lugging this extra unusable amount around, hardly a selling feature and as Sir Percival has pointed out certainly limits the touring range unnecessarily doh


Regards Richard

1999 Indigo Blue +8
2009 4/4 Sport Green prev
1993 Connaught Green +8 prev





Re: Fuel Tank size [Re: SimonH] #742181
17/05/22 06:13 PM
17/05/22 06:13 PM
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Originally Posted by SimonH
Originally Posted by TBM
Originally Posted by Almond
Nice to know that Morgan are looking after me and want me always carry around that 16litres/12kg of fuel that I can't use in a light-weight sports car confused


Doesn't mean you can't use it, just you have to be confident about how far you can get on 16litres..... (I would have thought at least 100miles allowing for a bit of unusable volume at the bottom of the fuel pick up)

On older vehicles, you can alter (bend) the float arm to make the reading more accurate - not sure if possible with a more modern car.


The fuel pump wont actually pick up the last 16 litres......
ooo

So in reality the tank capacity is only approx 27 litres, or 6 gallons, which is very poor for continental touring


Jon M
Re: Fuel Tank size [Re: Sir Percival] #742182
17/05/22 06:18 PM
17/05/22 06:18 PM
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TBM Offline
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Is it possible to move the position of the fuel pump (drop it lower) so it picks up more fuel?


1972 4/4 4 seater - 3G Morganeer
Too many ratty motorbikes
Re: Fuel Tank size [Re: Sir Percival] #742186
17/05/22 07:12 PM
17/05/22 07:12 PM
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Shrewsbury
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p8mog  Offline
Just Getting Started

Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 45
Shrewsbury
As I’ve said, I average 300 miles normal driving in my 2021 Plus Four, that’s 50 miles more than my old 1998 Plus 8, so after 250 miles driving abroad I start to look for petrol and never had any problems.


Heron Grey Plus Four 2021

Previous:-
Connaught Green 4/4 1988
Black Plus 8 1998
Re: Fuel Tank size [Re: Sir Percival] #742188
17/05/22 07:13 PM
17/05/22 07:13 PM
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 9,567
Hampshire
Alistair Offline
Smile, it confuses them
Alistair  Offline
Smile, it confuses them
Needs to Get Out More!

Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 9,567
Hampshire
So from this we work out that the tank IS 43L.
If that you can suck about 30L of it through the pump installation.
As a result the chicken factor has been set using that point?


Just time to rent a thimble more petrol before dinner.
Re: Fuel Tank size [Re: Alistair] #742289
19/05/22 07:25 AM
19/05/22 07:25 AM
Joined: Dec 2018
Posts: 1,318
North of Stamford, UK
HeadlessBlue Offline
Has a lot to Say!
HeadlessBlue  Offline
Has a lot to Say!

Joined: Dec 2018
Posts: 1,318
North of Stamford, UK
I’ve always managed 27 litres and no more from full tank to orange light going on. This seems to equate roughly to about 250 miles depending on how much I engage warp drive for the pops sound effect…😇
HB


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