Talk Morgan

3.7 l Roadster advice please

Posted By: John V6

3.7 l Roadster advice please - 12/09/20 04:05 PM

Having got the beast today it started to loosen up well on the way home , the PO had done 500 miles in 2 years.
My biggest concern is judging the speed. Has anyone worked out the revs in top or other gears for 30, 40, 50, 60 & 70? Following the traffic on the "smart" M25 I was doing roughly 65 it seemed.

The box improved once used and rev hang wasn't an issue but it does have the ECU upgrade.
1st seems a waste of time in normal traffic & 6th is not so reactive at 70 as my old 5 speed S1.
Posted By: Stringers Best Mate

Re: 3.7 l Roadster advice please - 12/09/20 04:54 PM

That's about right.. thumbs

I always used the SatNav for speed especially with the tonneau cover fitted (still for sale BTW..) but about 2500 was 70 I think. In top. Can't say I remember what the revs were looking like flat out, though. Thought it best to keep looking ahead..!!

Incidentally, if you Google The Brooklands Belle, there are plenty of images on the web for you..
Posted By: Richard Wood

Re: 3.7 l Roadster advice please - 12/09/20 05:01 PM

Its all here John with speeds @ max 6850rpm.

[Linked Image]

Note this is for my car though with 16" wires and 205/55/R16 tyres. I believe yours has 15" rims and slightly taller 60% profile tyres so will be similar

I can give you the Excel file if you wish so you can insert your own revs/mile for greater accuracy.

ETA: FWIW your driving impressions concur perfectly with mine. Rarely use first and to expidite motorway overtaking you need to change down a gear or two as 70mph is only just over 2000rpm. 6th can give you 33 real mpg (remember the digital readout is US mpg) though.
Posted By: CooperMan

Re: 3.7 l Roadster advice please - 12/09/20 06:13 PM

John, yes I agree with you comments re 1st & 6th, I use a head up display of speed which takes a signal off the OBD2 port as the speedometer is a pain to read accurately
Posted By: John V6

Re: 3.7 l Roadster advice please - 12/09/20 06:43 PM

Cheers guys
Posted By: MR11MOG

Re: 3.7 l Roadster advice please - 13/09/20 07:42 AM

I have a digital speedo sitting on the steering wheel cowl right in front of me ,it Runs from the OBD port is also adjustable To get the accurate speed .I got the accurate reading from the sat nav And adjusted it as the Factory speedo runs 7 mph fast at 70 .
It also gives a selection of engine temp ,voltage ,revs ,audible speed settings ,and other things .I don’t use the Factory speedo any more .Total cost £20.00 From eBay .
Superb piece of kit .
Posted By: John V6

Re: 3.7 l Roadster advice please - 13/09/20 08:07 AM

That would make sense. Mine seemed c 7 mph slow at 70.
Posted By: R1006

Re: 3.7 l Roadster advice please - 13/09/20 08:17 AM

I agree with the above, I also run the same as Peter & Jon , an excellent investment, having been caught doing 34 in 30 by The cameras
Posted By: John V6

Re: 3.7 l Roadster advice please - 13/09/20 11:47 AM

Mine is on order. Have asked Bell & Colvill if the speedo can be recalibrated.
Posted By: Richard Wood

Re: 3.7 l Roadster advice please - 13/09/20 02:32 PM

I've used in the past an OBDII Bluetooth dongle linked to OBD Check app on my Android phone.

[Linked Image]

Impressive to see all the dials light up when you start engine. You also get max and min dial markers for each session.

The Speedo on my car, what you can see of it and allowing for parallax, seems reasonably accurate.
Posted By: John V6

Re: 3.7 l Roadster advice please - 13/09/20 04:22 PM

I have asked Bell & covill if it can be recalibrated somehow.
For now the Sat Nav is in use though at 2000 rpm
20 is in second
30 is in Third
40 in 4th
50 in 5th
70 in 6th

60 is 2.5k in 5th
Based upon the sat nav & your spreadsheet.
Posted By: rid967

Re: 3.7 l Roadster advice please - 13/09/20 04:52 PM

Originally Posted by CooperMan
John, yes I agree with you comments re 1st & 6th, I use a head up display of speed which takes a signal off the OBD2 port as the speedometer is a pain to read accurately

Hi Jon
What product do you use? I bought the same one as Mr11MOG but could not get it to work at all.
Posted By: CooperMan

Re: 3.7 l Roadster advice please - 13/09/20 04:56 PM

Originally Posted by rid967
Originally Posted by CooperMan
John, yes I agree with you comments re 1st & 6th, I use a head up display of speed which takes a signal off the OBD2 port as the speedometer is a pain to read accurately

Hi Jon
What product do you use? I bought the same one as Mr11MOG but could not get it to work at all.


Unfortunately I have very little info on it as it was MR11MOG's reject that he didn't like, I'll do you a photo later

[Linked Image]
Posted By: rid967

Re: 3.7 l Roadster advice please - 13/09/20 06:07 PM

Originally Posted by CooperMan
Originally Posted by rid967
Originally Posted by CooperMan
John, yes I agree with you comments re 1st & 6th, I use a head up display of speed which takes a signal off the OBD2 port as the speedometer is a pain to read accurately

Hi Jon
What product do you use? I bought the same one as Mr11MOG but could not get it to work at all.


Unfortunately I have very little info on it as it was MR11MOG's reject that he didn't like, I'll do you a photo later

[Linked Image]

Cheers!
Posted By: Richard Wood

Re: 3.7 l Roadster advice please - 13/09/20 08:28 PM

Don't need a head up speed display with swmbo in the passenger seat. Armed with the speedo in front of her nose, a seemingly built in GPS and the greatest vigilance of speed limits, I get constant audible feedback of my speed and limit transgressions. I just need to master the volume control innocent
Posted By: Heinz

Re: 3.7 l Roadster advice please - 13/09/20 08:43 PM

Richard, you could add some steps of the speed display calibration so she get „better“ numbers to see... for example 50 mph instead of 58 mph.
Posted By: StevieMac

Re: 3.7 l Roadster advice please - 13/09/20 08:55 PM

Originally Posted by John V6
I have asked Bell & covill if it can be recalibrated somehow.
For now the Sat Nav is in use though at 2000 rpm
20 is in second
30 is in Third
40 in 4th
50 in 5th
70 in 6th

60 is 2.5k in 5th
Based upon the sat nav & your spreadsheet.


Hi John,

Having struggled with the speedo, I tried to use a combo of the revs and gear to gauge my speed. I had come to a similar conclusion for 2K RPM and the speeds B&C have suggested for 2nd to 5th.

I did purchase a Sat Nav with speed indicator, I am not sure that is overly accurate either.

Regards

Steve
Posted By: Paul F

Re: 3.7 l Roadster advice please - 14/09/20 12:10 PM

Originally Posted by Richard Wood
Don't need a head up speed display with swmbo in the passenger seat. Armed with the speedo in front of her nose, a seemingly built in GPS and the greatest vigilance of speed limits, I get constant audible feedback of my speed and limit transgressions. I just need to master the volume control innocent


I have one of these - very nearly the same model. On a journey down the Fosse Way a few years ago, she had laryngitis and couldn’t do much more than whisper. Our journey time was reduced by 30 minutes.
Posted By: CooperMan

Re: 3.7 l Roadster advice please - 14/09/20 04:20 PM

Originally Posted by Paul F
Originally Posted by Richard Wood
Don't need a head up speed display with swmbo in the passenger seat. Armed with the speedo in front of her nose, a seemingly built in GPS and the greatest vigilance of speed limits, I get constant audible feedback of my speed and limit transgressions. I just need to master the volume control innocent


I have one of these - very nearly the same model. On a journey down the Fosse Way a few years ago, she had laryngitis and couldn’t do much more than whisper. Our journey time was reduced by 30 minutes.


Did your MPG drop as well ?
Posted By: CooperMan

Re: 3.7 l Roadster advice please - 14/09/20 04:24 PM

Photos for Rid967...

[Linked Image]

[Linked Image]

No makers or model info on the instructions, unit measures approx 3.5" x 2" and is velcro'd to dash top
Posted By: Themorganeer

Re: 3.7 l Roadster advice please - 14/09/20 07:49 PM

Originally Posted by Paul F
Originally Posted by Richard Wood
Don't need a head up speed display with swmbo in the passenger seat. Armed with the speedo in front of her nose, a seemingly built in GPS and the greatest vigilance of speed limits, I get constant audible feedback of my speed and limit transgressions. I just need to master the volume control innocent


I have one of these - very nearly the same model. On a journey down the Fosse Way a few years ago, she had laryngitis and couldn’t do much more than whisper. Our journey time was reduced by 30 minutes.


Me also. Must be the secret optional extra that comes FOC with every passenger seat!
Posted By: Paul F

Re: 3.7 l Roadster advice please - 14/09/20 08:30 PM

Originally Posted by CooperMan
Originally Posted by Paul F
Originally Posted by Richard Wood
Don't need a head up speed display with swmbo in the passenger seat. Armed with the speedo in front of her nose, a seemingly built in GPS and the greatest vigilance of speed limits, I get constant audible feedback of my speed and limit transgressions. I just need to master the volume control innocent


I have one of these - very nearly the same model. On a journey down the Fosse Way a few years ago, she had laryngitis and couldn’t do much more than whisper. Our journey time was reduced by 30 minutes.


Did your MPG drop as well ?


There was a minor change- around 10% IIRC. Don’t tell Mrs F - it adds to her “justification” for her role as arbiter of speed in all situations.
Posted By: xc68anc

Re: 3.7 l Roadster advice please - 17/09/20 05:08 AM

About the calibration of the speedo, I‘ve got a 2018 plus4 (german Model) and the speedo has the same difference.

The difference is exactly 10%. So I drive 77KM/ it‘s real 70KM. I think it‘s wrong all over all MOGs from factory.

On the way home from Britain this year my friend and me want to know what she‘s able to do...
The speedo shows 190 KM/h, the nav says 172. (German Autobahn without speedolimit - clear) So I think the speedo shows the wrong speed all over the dial.

René
Posted By: Kevcaster

Re: 3.7 l Roadster advice please - 17/09/20 07:22 AM

Originally Posted by John V6
I have asked Bell & covill if it can be recalibrated somehow.
For now the Sat Nav is in use though at 2000 rpm
20 is in second
30 is in Third
40 in 4th
50 in 5th
70 in 6th

60 is 2.5k in 5th
Based upon the sat nav & your spreadsheet.

These are the same for my 09 Plus 4
Posted By: John V6

Re: 3.7 l Roadster advice please - 17/09/20 07:55 AM

Rene,
mine under reads so 70 is 77 mph. That I understand is illegal. I beleive car speedo should show the speed with a range of -0 to +10%.
The way my car is set up is n opportunity to lose my license.
Posted By: Heinz

Re: 3.7 l Roadster advice please - 17/09/20 07:55 AM

We must distinguish two things here. Do I want to read an exact speed indication while driving? Or do I want to know exactly how long the distance travelled is in miles or kilometres?
As I have experienced, the relationship between these two objectives is fixed and unchangeably programmed.
So if you want to see the exact speed while driving, the odometer does not count enough kilometres driven.
If you want to see the exact distance, you will see more speed on the speedometer than it is while driving. This is because the speed indicator needs to show a little more than is. Strictly according to the law, the odometer has to be calibrated, and consequently the speedometer shows slightly higher values. Of course it should not be too much.
Posted By: Richard Wood

Re: 3.7 l Roadster advice please - 17/09/20 08:27 AM

Originally Posted by John V6
Rene,
mine under reads so 70 is 77 mph. That I understand is illegal. I beleive car speedo should show the speed with a range of -0 to +10%.
The way my car is set up is n opportunity to lose my license.

Didn't realise the 10% error was in that direction John given as you suggest, a speedo that under reads is illegal. Most over read to the tune of 5-8% as you know. Suggest having a look at the Mustang forums on this subject. A further thought is your factory modified PCM (ECU) may offer more tweaking opportunities given its the device the gearbox output sensor communicates with [Linked Image]. Indeed that PCM may be the cause of the issue, as I believe the testing Adrian (AJSki2fly) did on behalf of MMC involved such.
Posted By: xc68anc

Re: 3.7 l Roadster advice please - 17/09/20 08:28 AM

Originally Posted by John V6
Rene,
mine under reads so 70 is 77 mph. That I understand is illegal. I beleive car speedo should show the speed with a range of -0 to +10%.
The way my car is set up is n opportunity to lose my license.


Oh, John, yes. I was wrong. My speedo is optimistic and give me the illusion of a 120miles +4...

A speedo with showing you ´re to slow is also not roadlegal in Germany. And as Heinz sayed, if it shows you are too fast/ slow it´s the same difference in the distance you drive.

René
Posted By: Graham, G4FUJ

Re: 3.7 l Roadster advice please - 17/09/20 10:42 AM

Originally Posted by John V6
Rene,
mine under reads so 70 is 77 mph. That I understand is illegal. I believe car speedo should show the speed with a range of -0 to +10%.

Correct.
Both my 4/4 have under read speed (it's why I have added GPS based speedometers). I think in both cases (they were/are mechanical) that is likely due to lack of use by previous owners. However, as yours is electronic, it sounds as though it has been incorrectly calibrated.
Posted By: John V6

Re: 3.7 l Roadster advice please - 17/09/20 11:09 AM

I think so Graham along with the fuel gauge. B&C are working on it.
I know other Roadster owners where it was spot on.
My GPS speedo arrived today so will add that.
Posted By: Deejay

Re: 3.7 l Roadster advice please - 17/09/20 02:43 PM

on a plus 4, the speedo can be recalibrated. Keep the trip recorder button under the dash depressed whilst starting the engine and a code will appear in the mileometer. as each digit flashes, it can be changed by multiple presses of the reset button and will finally revert to normal mileage reading. think a plus 4 was something like 008386, but guess codes vary for different models. Don’t know how much the number needs to be changed to achieve a significant alteration though but others might?
Also, if the speedo is difficult to read with tonneau in place, why not swap positions of rev counter and speedo. (unless you are always driving to the red line!) I am told that the wiring is usually long enough to do that.
Posted By: DaveW

Re: 3.7 l Roadster advice please - 17/09/20 03:05 PM

http://www.talkmorgan.com/ubbthreads.php/topics/154911/re-calibrating-speedo

^^VDO unit
Posted By: John V6

Re: 3.7 l Roadster advice please - 17/09/20 04:51 PM

The Mustang forum suggests reflashing the PCM. I will let Bell & Covill figure that out with MMC as they sold me an illegal car.
Meanwhile I have a cheap GPS speedo to help
Posted By: StevieMac

Re: 3.7 l Roadster advice please - 17/09/20 09:47 PM

I purchased a sat nav for touring around Cornwall, the added benefit being it had a speedo, although as stated earlier, I am not wholly convinced it is accurate - going by road side speed warning displays.

It is also a bit too much hassle for every day trips.

I did think about adding a digital readout that connected to the ODB port, is this worth it though? Would the data from the ODB port be more accurate?

Appreciate any guidance.

Steve
Posted By: Ray

Re: 3.7 l Roadster advice please - 17/09/20 09:52 PM

My tom tom seems to match closely with my speedo and most roadside signs.
Posted By: +8Rich

Re: 3.7 l Roadster advice please - 17/09/20 09:59 PM

I totally rely on my Tomtom and find it shows all three cars to be over reading by + 5mph, the variable Motorway speed limits agree with it so I'm assuming it's pretty accurate.
It's kept me safe from the revenue collectors since 1991 so somethings working, the best £90 I ever spent.
Posted By: Richard Wood

Re: 3.7 l Roadster advice please - 18/09/20 12:21 PM

Adrian's thread on the PCM (ECU) development leading to the one you have John is here. You will note there is specific reference to trip and speedometer anomalies!
Posted By: Paul F

Re: 3.7 l Roadster advice please - 18/09/20 03:12 PM

I have a GPS Speedo on the steering column. It agrees with roadside signs all the time and reads around the same as the speedo.

If you use self adhesive velcro on the steering column behind the dashboard and fabricate a bracket from an old tupperware box, you can make quite a neat unobtrusive fastening that is easy to remove when the time comes for the car to be sold. I power it from a USB socket fitted in the radio blanking plate.
Posted By: CooperMan

Re: 3.7 l Roadster advice please - 18/09/20 06:59 PM

Originally Posted by StevieMac
I purchased a sat nav for touring around Cornwall, the added benefit being it had a speedo, although as stated earlier, I am not wholly convinced it is accurate - going by road side speed warning displays.

It is also a bit too much hassle for every day trips.

I did think about adding a digital readout that connected to the ODB port, is this worth it though? Would the data from the ODB port be more accurate?

Appreciate any guidance.

Steve



Steve, that's what mine is, if you look earlier in the tread there's some photos
Posted By: StevieMac

Re: 3.7 l Roadster advice please - 18/09/20 09:52 PM

Originally Posted by CooperMan
Originally Posted by StevieMac
I purchased a sat nav for touring around Cornwall, the added benefit being it had a speedo, although as stated earlier, I am not wholly convinced it is accurate - going by road side speed warning displays.

It is also a bit too much hassle for every day trips.

I did think about adding a digital readout that connected to the ODB port, is this worth it though? Would the data from the ODB port be more accurate?

Appreciate any guidance.

Steve



Steve, that's what mine is, if you look earlier in the tread there's some photos


Cheers for the pointer Jon.

I was looking at something similar on the web before I went the Sat Nav route but that does look a little simpler,

How visible is the readout in bright light?

Steve
Posted By: CooperMan

Re: 3.7 l Roadster advice please - 19/09/20 10:48 AM

Originally Posted by StevieMac
Originally Posted by CooperMan
Originally Posted by StevieMac
I purchased a sat nav for touring around Cornwall, the added benefit being it had a speedo, although as stated earlier, I am not wholly convinced it is accurate - going by road side speed warning displays.

It is also a bit too much hassle for every day trips.

I did think about adding a digital readout that connected to the ODB port, is this worth it though? Would the data from the ODB port be more accurate?

Appreciate any guidance.

Steve



Steve, that's what mine is, if you look earlier in the tread there's some photos


Cheers for the pointer Jon.

I was looking at something similar on the web before I went the Sat Nav route but that does look a little simpler,

How visible is the readout in bright light?

Steve


Been using it for 2yrs now, in all weather conditions, I think it auto dims when light conditions are dull & with the little reflective patch applied to the 'screen never had issues in sunlight & we always drive top down
Posted By: John V6

Re: 3.7 l Roadster advice please - 19/09/20 05:45 PM

Richard the mpg odometer etc seems roughly right The fuel gauge is pants. It show 3/4 when full. The tank enpty come on at c 210 miles.
The tank then brims with roughly 27 I.e. half a tank. The range to empty follows the gauge.

The throttle pedal sits lower than the clutch & the brake. So to go from power to brake I need to pull my leg up and lift that foot over the brake pedal. Does anyone know if the can be adjusted to be aligned and how?. This surely isn't normal.
Posted By: John V6

Re: 3.7 l Roadster advice please - 19/09/20 05:51 PM

Originally Posted by CooperMan
Originally Posted by StevieMac
Originally Posted by CooperMan
Originally Posted by StevieMac
I purchased a sat nav for touring around Cornwall, the added benefit being it had a speedo, although as stated earlier, I am not wholly convinced it is accurate - going by road side speed warning displays.

It is also a bit too much hassle for every day trips.

I did think about adding a digital readout that connected to the ODB port, is this worth it though? Would the data from the ODB port be more accurate?

Appreciate any guidance.

Steve



Steve, that's what mine is, if you look earlier in the tread there's some photos


Cheers for the pointer Jon.

I was looking at something similar on the web before I went the Sat Nav route but that does look a little simpler,

How visible is the readout in bright light?

Steve


Been using it for 2yrs now, in all weather conditions, I think it auto dims when light conditions are dull & with the little reflective patch applied to the 'screen never had issues in sunlight & we always drive top down

Jon
Does it power up automatically as you start the car or do you need to disconnect and connect it via the obd2 port?
Posted By: xc68anc

Re: 3.7 l Roadster advice please - 19/09/20 06:07 PM

Hello John,

for an electronic speedo there are two points about interest.

1) the mechanism that counts something. It‘s a little bit like a bicycle speedo. It needs a signal. That‘s fixed by turning something mechanic. Gearbox output, wheelsensor, propshaft or something in this way.

2) in this way there is a Sensor counting the revs and give it to the speedo. This signal is every time the same, doesn‘t matter about voltage or some other electric/ electronic points. This signal would be mulitplicated by a number „x“ fixed in the speedo. In the usual way
the „x“ could be changed to calibrat the speedo.

That‘s the usual way in all electronic speedos.

I wonder that easteuropean „cardealers“ could change every number in the speedo and the odo, but the „real“ dealers doesn‘t know about it.

René
Posted By: Richard Wood

Re: 3.7 l Roadster advice please - 19/09/20 07:29 PM

Originally Posted by John V6
Richard the mpg odometer etc seems roughly right The fuel gauge is pants. It show 3/4 when full. The tank enpty come on at c 210 miles.
The tank then brims with roughly 27 I.e. half a tank. The range to empty follows the gauge.

The throttle pedal sits lower than the clutch & the brake. So to go from power to brake I need to pull my leg up and lift that foot over the brake pedal. Does anyone know if the can be adjusted to be aligned and how?. This surely isn't normal.

Don't find the throttle position an issue on mine John. I do have to heel and toe approaching a tight bend or roundabout for a smooth drop, typically into third, due to flywheel inertia. This took a bit of mastering given close pedals but find it easy now using the side of my foot on throttle.

The anomalies with yours seem to be stacking up. Wonder if its the price you have to pay for a rev hang free car [Linked Image]. Tony's (MorgantheFreeman) car was built the same time as yours, does he have any of these issues?
Posted By: IcePack

Re: 3.7 l Roadster advice please - 19/09/20 07:31 PM

John I had my accelerator pedal modified to allow heel & Toe. (As organ pedal could not be fitted)
Posted By: DaveW

Re: 3.7 l Roadster advice please - 19/09/20 07:40 PM

I fitted an Mx5 throttle pedal rubber to my Plus 4.

It improves things a bit. And has Roadster moulded into the rubber.
Posted By: John V6

Re: 3.7 l Roadster advice please - 19/09/20 08:20 PM

Dave the difference is 2 inches so it needs to a lump of wood.
Richard I'll see how yours looks on Wed.
Posted By: CooperMan

Re: 3.7 l Roadster advice please - 20/09/20 05:32 PM

Originally Posted by John V6

Jon
Does it power up automatically as you start the car or do you need to disconnect and connect it via the obd2 port?


It's permanently connected to the under dash OBD port & powers up automatically (there's a tiny slide switch if you don't want it on)
Posted By: CooperMan

Re: 3.7 l Roadster advice please - 20/09/20 05:40 PM

Originally Posted by John V6
Richard the mpg odometer etc seems roughly right The fuel gauge is pants. It show 3/4 when full. The tank enpty come on at c 210 miles.
The tank then brims with roughly 27 I.e. half a tank. The range to empty follows the gauge.

The throttle pedal sits lower than the clutch & the brake. So to go from power to brake I need to pull my leg up and lift that foot over the brake pedal. Does anyone know if the can be adjusted to be aligned and how?. This surely isn't normal.


John, the fuel low warning is wrong, I don't bother with the dash gauge much now as the digital 'range left' is really accurate, my low fuel warning consistently triggers at 50 to go

What MPG is it showing (will be in US galls) ?
Posted By: John V6

Re: 3.7 l Roadster advice please - 20/09/20 05:57 PM

It shows c 30 since I reset it. If I do it on the fuel filled & mileage I get 29 ish
Posted By: CooperMan

Re: 3.7 l Roadster advice please - 21/09/20 11:33 AM

Originally Posted by John V6
It shows c 30 since I reset it. If I do it on the fuel filled & mileage I get 29 ish


Looks a bit optimistic for a 3.7, that's 35 - 36 UK mpg, (better than my old S1 3.0) I wonder if your speedo calibration also effects this ? I'm usually reading 26.2 - 27.8 on dash data US, so only 31 - 33 mpg UK
Posted By: Richard Wood

Re: 3.7 l Roadster advice please - 23/09/20 07:52 AM

Originally Posted by CooperMan
Originally Posted by John V6
It shows c 30 since I reset it. If I do it on the fuel filled & mileage I get 29 ish


Looks a bit optimistic for a 3.7, that's 35 - 36 UK mpg, (better than my old S1 3.0) I wonder if your speedo calibration also effects this ? I'm usually reading 26.2 - 27.8 on dash data US, so only 31 - 33 mpg UK

FWIW that concurs closely with mine Jon. I have seen slightly over 30 displayed on a freshly reset counter whilst on busy road at a steady 50mph in sixth though.
Posted By: John V6

Re: 3.7 l Roadster advice please - 23/09/20 08:24 AM

Now it is running at roughly 29 mpg on the display & just under 29 using mileage & fuel added . A one off check of distance from google vs the odo shows c 4% under reading. Can't say I am bothered about that.
The speedo error & the crap fuel gauge is more annoying.
Posted By: StevieMac

Re: 3.7 l Roadster advice please - 23/09/20 07:35 PM

Originally Posted by John V6
Now it is running at roughly 29 mpg on the display & just under 29 using mileage & fuel added . A one off check of distance from google vs the odo shows c 4% under reading. Can't say I am bothered about that.
The speedo error & the crap fuel gauge is more annoying.


I have the same issue with the fuel gauge John, it never goes above a 3/4 reading and it runs low way earlier than is accurate. I am yet to fill up and put 30L or more in the tank.

I am currently trying to rely on resetting the trip counter when I refuel but still not brave enough to run for too long as the dial drops.

It is an annoyance but with all of the other madness in the world, I'm learning to live with it.
Posted By: CooperMan

Re: 3.7 l Roadster advice please - 24/09/20 08:54 AM

Originally Posted by StevieMac
Originally Posted by John V6
Now it is running at roughly 29 mpg on the display & just under 29 using mileage & fuel added . A one off check of distance from google vs the odo shows c 4% under reading. Can't say I am bothered about that.
The speedo error & the crap fuel gauge is more annoying.


I have the same issue with the fuel gauge John, it never goes above a 3/4 reading and it runs low way earlier than is accurate. I am yet to fill up and put 30L or more in the tank.

I am currently trying to rely on resetting the trip counter when I refuel but still not brave enough to run for too long as the dial drops.

It is an annoyance but with all of the other madness in the world, I'm learning to live with it.


I've found the digital data via the info button reliable, so much so that I've driven confidently without range anxiety and got 43 lts in, the 3.7 is THE most accurate Mog I've owned for fuel data
Posted By: John V6

Re: 3.7 l Roadster advice please - 24/09/20 10:57 AM

It is the only one I have owned with fuel data.
Posted By: StevieMac

Re: 3.7 l Roadster advice please - 24/09/20 08:29 PM

Originally Posted by CooperMan
Originally Posted by StevieMac
Originally Posted by John V6
Now it is running at roughly 29 mpg on the display & just under 29 using mileage & fuel added . A one off check of distance from google vs the odo shows c 4% under reading. Can't say I am bothered about that.
The speedo error & the crap fuel gauge is more annoying.


I have the same issue with the fuel gauge John, it never goes above a 3/4 reading and it runs low way earlier than is accurate. I am yet to fill up and put 30L or more in the tank.

I am currently trying to rely on resetting the trip counter when I refuel but still not brave enough to run for too long as the dial drops.

It is an annoyance but with all of the other madness in the world, I'm learning to live with it.


I've found the digital data via the info button reliable, so much so that I've driven confidently without range anxiety and got 43 lts in, the 3.7 is THE most accurate Mog I've owned for fuel data


Thanks Jon,

I had not noticed the info button gave any data on the fuel except for the 1 time I let the warning light come on and there was a range indicator of remaining miles. I think I fueled up with less than 50 miles remaining, I managed to get about 27 liters in the tank!

I'll flick through the readings again at the weekend.

Cheers

Steve
Posted By: CooperMan

Re: 3.7 l Roadster advice please - 25/09/20 08:37 AM

Steve, each time you dab the INFO button it will scroll tho the following

Trip A (I use this as my daily log of miles)
Trip B (I reset when refueled)
Miles to empty (counts down & triggers the 50 mile warning light)
Average MPG (note in US galls), since last reset
MPG bar graph
Timer
and finally a blank screen

after you start the car, whatever you've scrolled too will stay as your display (which you can change en-route)
Posted By: StevieMac

Re: 3.7 l Roadster advice please - 25/09/20 05:36 PM

Originally Posted by CooperMan
Steve, each time you dab the INFO button it will scroll tho the following

Trip A (I use this as my daily log of miles)
Trip B (I reset when refueled)
Miles to empty (counts down & triggers the 50 mile warning light)
Average MPG (note in US galls), since last reset
MPG bar graph
Timer
and finally a blank screen

after you start the car, whatever you've scrolled too will stay as your display (which you can change en-route)


Thank you Jon, really appreciate the detail here.

It is the 3rd option I had not spotted (Miles to empty), will set this as my 'home screen'.
Posted By: StevieMac

Re: 3.7 l Roadster advice please - 27/09/20 07:46 PM

Originally Posted by CooperMan
Steve, each time you dab the INFO button it will scroll tho the following

Trip A (I use this as my daily log of miles)
Trip B (I reset when refueled)
Miles to empty (counts down & triggers the 50 mile warning light)
Average MPG (note in US galls), since last reset
MPG bar graph
Timer
and finally a blank screen

after you start the car, whatever you've scrolled too will stay as your display (which you can change en-route)



Out for a quick spin today, stopped to fill the car up with the 'Miles to empty' reading 100 miles...I managed to get 26.6 litres into the tank. Isn't the tank supposed to be 55 litres?

On the plus side, it read 328 miles after refueling but I am not sure how far I'd trust that before I top up again.
Posted By: Richard Wood

Re: 3.7 l Roadster advice please - 27/09/20 08:12 PM

Might be worth checking a zero'd trip from a full tank and comparing with miles to go as it clocks down. Maybe worth re-setting average mpg as well as I think it uses that figure to calculate miles to go.

FWIW I filled up this morning at 35 miles to go and it took 45 litres which seems close enough to me.
Posted By: John V6

Re: 3.7 l Roadster advice please - 28/09/20 10:24 AM

It makes no difference Richard. Mine dropped 15 miles to go on a 4 mile run as the tank shows under 1/4 but driven miles are 180.
Does anyone know what happens if the ECU thinks the tank is empty ? Does it stop the engine.
Posted By: Richard Wood

Re: 3.7 l Roadster advice please - 28/09/20 11:09 AM

Can't believe it would ever do that John, what would be the point?

Regarding miles to empty reading, it will drop dramatically if you drive hardish especially shortly after an average mpg reset because the latter will drop dramatically as well.

As you can see the fuel level sensing is quite complex and it would only take one of those level sensors to go u/s to really mess it up.

[Linked Image]
Posted By: John V6

Re: 3.7 l Roadster advice please - 28/09/20 04:10 PM

There are reports on the Mustang forums of new cars where the fuel warning stopped the engine despite 1/2 tank.
I can't see the point either & maybe they aren't related.
Posted By: John V6

Re: 3.7 l Roadster advice please - 01/10/20 04:47 PM

Well an update on the progress on Belle. Bell &Colvill have been very helpful, MMC have been there usual self.
B&C will fix the fuel gauge even collecting my car from Felixstowe, fixing it & returning it from Leatherhead. Excellent service I think you would agree. notworthy happy3

MMC see a 10% under reading speedo as not an issue & anyway it can't be recalibrated they say (Mustang forums say otherwise). But it is legal they say, I thought speedos could over but not under read. You have been warned if you have a 3.7 l Roadster you may be inadvertently speeding. mad2

MMC also advise not to do anything with the throttle pedal that sits (I checked today) a massive 3 1/2 inches below the brake pedal. So so much for a sports car pedal box. I think I'll buy a bit of 2 x4 and work it down to the right dimension whilst Cain works up a solution. mad2
[Linked Image]
Posted By: Graham, G4FUJ

Re: 3.7 l Roadster advice please - 02/10/20 07:27 AM

Originally Posted by John V6

MMC see a 10% under reading speedo as not an issue & anyway it can't be recalibrated they say (Mustang forums say otherwise). But it is legal they say, I thought speedos could over but not under read. You have been warned if you have a 3.7 l Roadster you may be inadvertently speeding. mad2

You are correct John. I'm really surprised at the factory's response over that.
Posted By: SimonH

Re: 3.7 l Roadster advice please - 02/10/20 09:36 AM

Originally Posted by John V6
Well an update on the progress on Belle. Bell &Colvill have been very helpful, MMC have been there usual self.
B&C will fix the fuel gauge even collecting my car from Felixstowe, fixing it & returning it from Leatherhead. Excellent service I think you would agree. notworthy happy3

MMC see a 10% under reading speedo as not an issue & anyway it can't be recalibrated they say (Mustang forums say otherwise). But it is legal they say, I thought speedos could over but not under read. You have been warned if you have a 3.7 l Roadster you may be inadvertently speeding. mad2

MMC also advise not to do anything with the throttle pedal that sits (I checked today) a massive 3 1/2 inches below the brake pedal. So so much for a sports car pedal box. I think I'll buy a bit of 2 x4 and work it down to the right dimension whilst Cain works up a solution. mad2
[Linked Image]


For the ARV6 i just made a new pedal, and left the drive by wire throttle box where it was, It was downright dangerous before
Posted By: John V6

Re: 3.7 l Roadster advice please - 02/10/20 02:00 PM

Simon,
I agree am looking at that with Cain but if you have solution please PM me the details
John
Posted By: CooperMan

Re: 3.7 l Roadster advice please - 13/10/20 04:51 PM

John, apologies a bit late to this thread, but for reference this is my footwell, at the lowest point of the throttle pedal it's almost flush with the brake, tapering back to approx 3/4" at mid point

[Linked Image]
Posted By: John V6

Re: 3.7 l Roadster advice please - 13/10/20 05:52 PM

Thanks Jon. Mine is 3 /12 inches between the throttle & the brake. I see there is room on the brake threaded rod that goes into the clevis pin assembly. Do ou know if you can literally just rotate the rod to reduce the gap? Or do you risk the seals on the hydraulics?
Posted By: CooperMan

Re: 3.7 l Roadster advice please - 13/10/20 06:02 PM

Originally Posted by John V6
Thanks Jon. Mine is 3 /12 inches between the throttle & the brake. I see there is room on the brake threaded rod that goes into the clevis pin assembly. Do ou know if you can literally just rotate the rod to reduce the gap? Or do you risk the seals on the hydraulics?

From memory I think you could adjust at the clevis joint after pulling the pin, I'll have a proper look tomorrow
Posted By: Richard Wood

Re: 3.7 l Roadster advice please - 13/10/20 07:49 PM

The parts book suggests a simple clevis joint with locknuts each side. Not much thread shown to work with on m/cylinder rod, but any adjustment will be amplified at brake pedal.
Posted By: John V6

Re: 3.7 l Roadster advice please - 13/10/20 07:51 PM

There is a lot on mine . At least of visible threads beyond the clevis pin.
If it is two nuts I guess that will be easier if I can get in there.
Posted By: Richard Wood

Re: 3.7 l Roadster advice please - 13/10/20 08:00 PM

That will be the problem John. Do you have a spanner monkey in the family who would respond to a bribe? wink
Posted By: John V6

Re: 3.7 l Roadster advice please - 14/10/20 07:28 AM

That would be me. Though I am at Cain's lockdown allowing on the 27th & before that also lockdown allowing it will be at B&C for the fuel gauge so I'll ask them.
Posted By: CooperMan

Re: 3.7 l Roadster advice please - 14/10/20 03:26 PM

Here you go John, you may have to watch the trigger point of the brake light switch as you adjust the clevis / rod

[Linked Image]
Posted By: John V6

Re: 3.7 l Roadster advice please - 21/10/20 03:35 PM

An update on the fuel gauge.
B&C have replaced the fuel pump & sensor which is one unit under warranty and also filled the tank FOC.
I get it back Thursday but am one happy customer.
Thank you Bell & Colvill
laugh2 thumbs
Posted By: Graham, G4FUJ

Re: 3.7 l Roadster advice please - 21/10/20 04:35 PM

Good news. thumbs
Posted By: John V6

Re: 3.7 l Roadster advice please - 27/10/20 08:38 PM

Today I fitted a buzzer for the indicators. This was off ebay & is diode protected. It was designed for a motorbike with two power leads (left & right) and an earth.
I chose to make connecting leads using connectors & a Y lead to the existing leads under the spare wheel so the loom isn't cut.
The leads then pass via a small drilled hole is the saddle board to leave the buzzer under the side of the drivers seat. I sealed the hole with white bath sealant.

Not so difficult and now I can hear if the indicators are on.
Posted By: rid967

Re: 3.7 l Roadster advice please - 27/10/20 08:46 PM

Cheers Jon.
Appreciate your photos.
Richard
Posted By: Richard Wood

Re: 3.7 l Roadster advice please - 27/10/20 09:04 PM

Great result on buzzer John.

Don't know if you saw the discussion on the fuel tank thread, but during posts I discovered our cars have dedicated separate ground/chassis connections for the micro-processor read fuel sensor circuit as well as dedicated +12 volt feed. This to alleviate the adverse effects of minute voltage drop in the cable from other devices pulling current through a shared circuit, particularly a ground connection (one contributor was having gauge changes when sidelights turned on).

It occured to me this would have been checked by B & C but should you have any issues in the future worth bearing in mind.

First came across this on external smart alternator controllers. There were two similar gauge black ground wires and instructions stipulated they had to remain separate although could be attached to the same grounding point. Reason was one carried the full field control return current whilst the other was the battery voltage sense return carrying no current.
Posted By: John V6

Re: 3.7 l Roadster advice please - 27/10/20 09:57 PM

Well today the gauge has performed well. Thanks for the heads up. See you fomorrow
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