Talk Morgan

Too precious towards the car?

Posted By: RBW

Too precious towards the car? - 06/12/20 07:14 PM

Evening All

Hope we are all well,

I've seen a few classics (VW Transporter MK1, Hillman Avenger, Ford Capri MK1, Jaguar S Type) in use this weekend on the heavily salted and wet roads in my area, which got me thinking.

My Morgan is now effectively off road until next year due to the weather etc, I don't drive it in the rain unless its unavoidable, I also get unsure when its heavily overcast. And as soon as salt appears that marks the end of the driving year.

I know many would say it's just a car and to enjoy it, but its not just any car if that makes sense? I normsally manage around 3000 miles a year.

However as a debate point - Am I being too precious towards it?

Thoughts welcome as always!
Posted By: andymot

Re: Too precious towards the car? - 06/12/20 07:23 PM

Too precious? Well some could argue you are just keeping it pristine for its next owner. Its a car and will thrive on use ( and care ) while sitting unused will do it no good.

But I'm on the precious scale myself - prefer not to use it when salt and happy to gaze at it in its dehumidified cave at this time of year. Thats it really - what ever makes you happy. As soon as the salt clears and its a dry day however I'll be out and about again, for the good of the car and the soul!. One of the best drives i had was on a mild and dry Christmas eve a few years ago.
Posted By: Jon G4LJW

Re: Too precious towards the car? - 06/12/20 07:27 PM

I'd prefer to wait for some rain after the salt, but have been out on salted roads. Sometimes our road is ok, but I find salt on the roads in the next village....

Driving a Morgan in the rain has never bothered me, but prefer to at least start out in the dry!
Posted By: +8Rich

Re: Too precious towards the car? - 06/12/20 07:31 PM


Get it out there and use it and thoroughly wash off the underside they are not made of sugar and life is way too short not to use them year round.

Of course if you are a concourse polisher that's a different issue altogether and I understand it, I think.. It's all about personal choices just like the Morgan you own it's all about YOUR enjoyment.



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Posted By: Treesurveyor

Re: Too precious towards the car? - 06/12/20 07:34 PM

It's your car RB, do as pleases you. Personally for me, I have my own attachment to Dot that compell me to drive her everyday I can, come what may, but thats my choice, and if I need to get to the jet wash and get under with some protective spray more often, then so be it.
Drive on, Drive safely, as and when it pleases you.
Phil
Posted By: Stringers Best Mate

Re: Too precious towards the car? - 06/12/20 08:22 PM

Done both in the past.

Firmly of the Drive don't Hide now.. Miss the old 4/4 in winter..

[Linked Image]
Posted By: Viper

Re: Too precious towards the car? - 06/12/20 08:34 PM

I understand wholeheartedly you situation.

All my life I’ve been a polisher, the mere mention of salt and i and my cars would go into hiding.

However as I get older and more recently I’m feeling like life is too short. My main passion in life is cars yet I’ll spend 5 months of the year driving a miserable car.

It is when I decided to buy a Plus 8 to drive everyday and that’s what I do. I absolutely love it and without a care. Worst case scenario is I have to restore it one day. Who knows but smothering in ACF 50 will help I’m sure.
Posted By: howard

Re: Too precious towards the car? - 06/12/20 08:53 PM

I am by nature a saver. Even at 75 I am saving a significant part of my income. Rationally that is totally pointless - with maybe 10 or 15 years to go, why deny yourself as my wife says.

Its the same with cars. I have twice now bought a low mileage toy car and find myself doing less than 1000 miles a year to avoid running up the mileage and reducing the sales value. DAFT!! doh But in the end you have to do what makes you happy and we are all different.

The only right answer to your question is the one that makes you happiest.

The Fezza is parked in a nice warm garage and is covered , believe it or not, by a duvet. blush
Posted By: Dave Collis

Re: Too precious towards the car? - 06/12/20 08:59 PM

Mine used to be driven all year round, not so much anymore, but still gets a fair number of miles racked up.
I have no issues driving in the rain, a good soaking makes the wood swell a little and the doors fit better

Like others, I prefer to start the drive in the dry, but if it gets wet, so be it. The top has very rarely been up
except when the wife not so tactfully suggested it went up!

Cheers,
Dave.
Posted By: Hamwich

Re: Too precious towards the car? - 06/12/20 09:49 PM

I've never been a high mileage driver in my Morgan, usually around 3 to 4k miles a year (and a heck of a lot less this year), but I've always made sure the car is able to be driven whenever I want.

I would think it would be a shame if you drove your car in conditions that concerned you, but equally well I think that it would also be sad if you denied yourself the pleasure of a drive just in case the weather became adverse. I completely understand the concern with salt, but rain really isn't an issue. It really doesn't take long to put the hood up if it starts raining, after all. Don't be put off by all this 'never put the hood up' posturing, it's just an affectation. Nobody takes it seriously.

Nobody dies wishing they'd spent more time in the office, and nobody dies wishing they hadn't driven their Morgan so much.
Posted By: Craig Jezz

Re: Too precious towards the car? - 06/12/20 10:28 PM

I try not to leave my 4/4 under cover for no more than 3 to 4 weeks if I can, even though it’s on a battery conditioner I like to get the engine properly warm.

Went for a blast at 6pm this evening, now she’s tucked up in bed again coffee

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Posted By: britmog

Re: Too precious towards the car? - 06/12/20 11:15 PM

I'm a driver as said above life is too short not too. The only time I don't take a moggy out is when there is ice or over 4 inches of snow on the lane, it's very steep and narrow with over a 100ft drop off on one side drive snow scared
Posted By: Bonesie

Re: Too precious towards the car? - 07/12/20 04:34 AM

Im with RBW

I dont mind cold, as long as its dry. I get no enjoyment from driving in wet weather. If it does rain while I'm out its not a biggy, just prefer if it didnt :-)

Also, getting my car out of the garage is a PITA as I have to juggle some cars around so that puts me off too. Havent been out in it for over a month innocent
Posted By: TBM

Re: Too precious towards the car? - 07/12/20 07:46 AM

I'd planned to go out Saturday morning, but someone had parked too far over my dropped kerb so it would have been 20 mins of edging back and forth so took the Corsa out instead.

Did fire her up Sunday and got the engine nice and warm and did some wiring, but CHRIST it was cold. Oh for a garage......
Posted By: RichardV6

Re: Too precious towards the car? - 07/12/20 08:08 AM

I try to take mine out at least once every two weeks in the winter although its a carefully calculated balancing act for reasonable conditions. Less concerned if the car already needs a wash but very wary of salt on the roads even if they are dry. In my M3W I could taste it on my lips and once its on the car it mixes with general dampness in the garage to create surface rust anywhere the paint protection has weakened, and suprisingly quickly. Almost as bad as if car had been put away wet!

A good wash underneath followed by drying run on local non-salted roads seems to work the best.

Mechanical sympathy would never have me start the car and run engine stationary. The only way to warm an engine up quickly is to drive it, warming the cold oil as quickly as possible. Even after a longish run I put the car on a smart charger once in a while and am always surprised how much more energy the battery will take.
Posted By: Peter J

Re: Too precious towards the car? - 07/12/20 08:20 AM

That I have Michelin Cross Climate tyres on the Plus 8 makes it clear how I use the car, as does this photo....

[Linked Image]

Hood up, heater on and heated seats warming me the Plus 8 is a nice place to be.
On dry roads, hood down, it is even nicer!

The car is all aluminium, the underside is undersealed and the upper surfaces are painted. It is no more likely to suffer from winter use than any other car.
BTW, the car is now washed and looks as it normally does!
Posted By: Gambalunga

Re: Too precious towards the car? - 07/12/20 08:30 AM

What with us being in almost continual lockdown this year the Morgan has had very little use. Like most I would not go out for a "fun" drive in the rain but it doesn't bother me and I have been out in some really biblical downpours.

As for snow I have driven it in the snow several times and in northern Italy we are obliged to carry chains in the car or have snow tyres fitted from 15 November to 15 April. I do have a set of chains but I can't imagine actually using them. Four years back I decided to fit Michelin CrossClimate tyres which are certified for the snow. I loose a very small amount of dry road braking (no problem in cornering grip) but gain enormously in wet weather handling and they are nearly as good as dedicated snow tyres when it snows. I would not use them if I wanted the ultimate sports car grip but for me they are a great all year round compromise.

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Posted By: John V6

Re: Too precious towards the car? - 07/12/20 08:59 AM

I avoid slated roads if I can, but otherwise I use it. Especially this year. I have done 2800 miles in the Brooklands since Sept.
[Linked Image]
Posted By: TBM

Re: Too precious towards the car? - 07/12/20 10:05 AM

My only annoyance is that during winter I keep the hood on - the cover fits better and stops the rain pooling on the cover over the tonneau cover (which inevitably leaks!).

Then, if it's a quick hour drive or so, I don't want the hassle of taking off the hood, side screens, sticking them all in the bags, getting the tonneau cover out and then doing the reverse when I get home. As a result, I'm often out with the roof up in winter. On th plus side, the heater is great and the heated seats work fabulously. However, getting in and out is a ballache.....
Posted By: Redfate

Re: Too precious towards the car? - 07/12/20 10:21 AM

Like others have said, its all down to what you are comfortable with.
I have motorcycles as well as the car, I ride them and drive the car all year round. I enjoy the driving while I'm out and then the next day or so enjoy the cleaning of them.
I get twice the enjoyment that way blush
Posted By: GaB

Re: Too precious towards the car? - 07/12/20 10:34 AM

Both me and Archie have gone into hibernation this year.
We are generally low mileage, tragically more so this year.
I got by far the greatest pleasure from taking people out (from the local hospice), and that was a deciding factor in buying my first Morgan.
Alas, this year has been a real pi$$er.
I am down to running the engine once a month up to temperature, and moving it up and down the garage.
Shameful.
Posted By: Moggo

Re: Too precious towards the car? - 07/12/20 10:38 AM

Its a state of mind issue. For example; those expensive watches advertised for you to become a mere custodian - so that your decendants might enjoy once your gone !
For myself its a case of knowing the 4/4 will probably outlast me. My ex MG F2 Magna in the hands of recently Dcd. owner, has outlasted him and will doubtless outlast me. That very collectable classic is today 88 years old and was driven in all weathers by me and by Ewan, (rest his dear soul).
I do try to avoid salted roads, but even in winter there are those times when rain washes off the salt and its good to go for an airing of the machine I bought to enjoy.
Even though my mileage is higher than normal the valuation done very recently, puts the 4/4 well above the price I paid for her. Thats pretty amazing, considering the intervening mileage covered in my hands is 72,000.
Posted By: sospan

Re: Too precious towards the car? - 07/12/20 01:00 PM

I categorise cars two types.
A VERY small number of cars with special status based on make, model, history, fragility.
Even most of these I would like to see used under controlled conditions and not just sitting round and gazed at.
The vast majority of cars should be driven. Now, how many miles? I can leave that to individual choice.
Unless I had oodles of money The first is a big no for me. Investment? No. What good is a car that you are unwilling to drive. You lose the enjoyment of driving it.
Even this year I have kept the car on the road albeit with a huge reduction in miles. I drive in most weather unless conditions make driving any car a no-go. Salt? Car is protected and gets washed. I play golf and think similarly about playing in varying weather. Sometimes it would be daft togo and play. Others, go with the flow with umbrella/waterproofs.
Apologies to people who molly coddle their Morgan but that is not for me. High mileage?? I just think of the enjoyment that brings.
Posted By: xc68anc

Re: Too precious towards the car? - 07/12/20 01:35 PM

I‘ m new in Morgans and got it only since two years. An collected 20.000KM in this time.

In a german classic Magazin there was a Word like: don‘t drive on salted roads and beware of British cars, they drive on salted roads.

That are not my words, that‘s what say the chief mechanic of a German Morgan dealer in the magazine. After one year of ownership I visit the factory and there I hear also „don’t drive on salted roads“.

But also: rain and wet doesn‘t matter if the car can dry in a usual way. And there are no worn seals where the water can soak in the wood.

So I go this way.

But I‘ m also in classic MINIs, these poor little things must out allways. But I prepare them with flushes of oil and wax and a massive wash in spring. As I understand the people „no salted roads“ so the problem with the Mog is the combination wood and the used different metals.

René
Posted By: Budster

Re: Too precious towards the car? - 07/12/20 01:35 PM

About 3,000 miles a year for me. I try to avoid salted roads in winter, but really enjoy winter drives.
I’ve never thought of my 4/4 as an investment, but it is nice that depreciation is negligible.

As a friend once said: “having a beautiful car and not using it, for fear of depreciation; is a bit like having a beautiful girlfriend and not making love, for fear of spoiling her for her next boyfriend!”
innocent

Bud
4/4 - Stanley
Posted By: Bonesie

Re: Too precious towards the car? - 07/12/20 02:17 PM

Originally Posted by Budster

As a friend once said: “having a beautiful car and not using it, for fear of depreciation; is a bit like having a beautiful girlfriend and not making love, for fear of spoiling her for her next boyfriend!”
innocent

Bud
4/4 - Stanley


Bloody hell, Bud. How rough is your sex haha . When you buy a car you dont generally buy one thats been wragged senseless by lots of previous 'owners' rofl
Posted By: Moggo

Re: Too precious towards the car? - 07/12/20 03:22 PM

I am thinking; if you have a beautifull girlfriend its best to hang on to her come rain or shine - salted roads or summer sun.. Like the cherished Morgan its best not to think of what the next owner might or might not do with her ! Lets not drift the subject matter beyond this point ! love
Posted By: JohnHarris

Re: Too precious towards the car? - 07/12/20 04:29 PM

I have been driving soft-top cars and motorcycles for most of my life. I currently have a Mercedes that has a mohair hood and the Morgan has the PVC hood. I try to drive everywhere with the roof down no matter what the weather, but mohair hoods take longer to dry out otherwise they permanently crease when folded down if not bone dry before being folded down, so rarely with these much wetter winters we get now do I get a chance to drive the Merc with the roof down during these wetter winters.

It's my first winter with this Morgan and already as it has a PVC hood I have taken the roof down far more wet or dry and enjoy open air motoring far more in the winter so far than with my Merc. This very cold damp morning I was out roof down before dawn and as with my previous Morgans, I drove them all year round. Although, I am slightly wary of driving in snow and icy conditions as they have no abs or traction control which can make them a handful in treacherous conditions.

I just accept that winter driving demands a more rigorous maintenance and cleaning regime, add to that you are more prone to get stone chips from salt grit.................
Posted By: Redfate

Re: Too precious towards the car? - 07/12/20 05:01 PM

I actually was lucky enough to be able drive mine more this year than previously, I was furloughed nearly all the summmer so went out in at least 3 times a week in it.
As to the winter drives, I have a Carcoon so can put it away wet if necessary and leave the Carcoon vent open which dries it off while inside the garage.
Then I can clean it in my own time without worrying.
Like others though, if there has been a recent surface salt treament I try to avoid using it until its rained again and washed most of it off the surface.
Posted By: sospan

Re: Too precious towards the car? - 07/12/20 05:13 PM

The deterents to stop me using the Morgan are deep snow, too much ice, heavy salting with no rain to clear it. Necessary journeys by car influence the choice of car as well depending on why the trip is being done (luggage needs, passengers etc). Add to that the post use cleaning/drying that might be needed after rain/snow/salt. Common sense sometimes overtakes the desire drive.
Posted By: Stephen888

Re: Too precious towards the car? - 07/12/20 05:31 PM

Many years ago (1983) when I first bought the +8 it was a daily driver so had no option summer or winter, but I did have a roof in those days. Since ditching the hood and side screens in 1986 I have used it in winter regularly, but do try and avoid salted roads. Easter 1998 we went to Kitbuehl Austria, drove home in the day to Cambridge (851 miles). When we left it was -7C and there was a foot of snow on the solidly frozen tonneau. Just made it back in time for a pint in the local. 15 hours.
Posted By: Viper

Re: Too precious towards the car? - 07/12/20 07:38 PM

That’s proper hardcore.

Hats off to you
Posted By: Guten

Re: Too precious towards the car? - 08/12/20 08:52 AM

I’m firmly in the no salt camp. Although it has galvi chassis, SS bulkhead and ally body there are still major components like cross head, heater box, plus’s sundry brackets that are just painted so salt, for me as a long term owner IS still an issue. I have cleaned, treated and painted all currently affected parts but still wouldn’t use it when the roads are salted. I wait for a good downpour to wash the roads down then use it year round - just more in the summer.
For me long term ownership is different to short term especially when the car will hold good value or (in the case of my ‘36 Austin) appreciate slowly.
Posted By: CooperMan

Re: Too precious towards the car? - 08/12/20 09:15 AM

Simon, part of the problem is the mixed metal that you mention above, steel, zinc, stainless steel, aluminium, add in some mixed metal fixings too and it's a cooking pot for bimetallic corrosion and even some potential galvanic rot as the metalwork is often used as the neutral (earth return), add some moisture then increase it's conductivity with salt & BOOM ! Well not quite, but you can almost hear it fizzing away
Posted By: Viper

Re: Too precious towards the car? - 08/12/20 10:41 AM

I thought I was bad.

If I thought too much about all the above I wouldn’t sleep
Posted By: HeadlessBlue

Re: Too precious towards the car? - 08/12/20 10:42 AM

With our previous Mog she was used all year round but generally avoided icy/ salted roads mainly as a result of following the advice on TM. Both with roof up or down -always with a smile on my face!
Please excuse my ignorance but with the new CX chassis is salt on the roads still as much of a concern when compared to the trad steel version?
Genuine question but don’t think I’ve seen it answered elsewhere on TM and I am a thicko mechanically/chemically...
Thanks in advance for explanation in simple language!!!!!
Cheers
HB
Ps apologies for thread drift
Posted By: Peter J

Re: Too precious towards the car? - 08/12/20 11:31 AM

Headless,

the CX chassis is closer to the Aero Chassis in that it is made up of pieces of aluminium, sheet, extrusions and some casting/forging pieces, all glued together. The under surfaces, at least on Tarka, are undersealed. I'd expect the CX chassis to be undersealed.
As with virtually all aluminium chassis cars they are designed to be used in all weathers and are less sensitive to corrosion than steel. Some aluminium alloys develop a surface corrosion which then protects the body of the metal. I don't know if MMC use this type of alloy anywhere.

If I had a CX chassis car I'd treat it as a modern, all weather, car.

Enjoy the future!
Posted By: HeadlessBlue

Re: Too precious towards the car? - 08/12/20 11:36 AM

Top notch reply
All, and I mean all, weather driving it will be then!!!!! 😝🥳🕺
Thanks Peter - that has given me a lot more confidence
HB
Posted By: DaveW

Re: Too precious towards the car? - 08/12/20 11:45 AM

I'm cautious with all my cars which means regular inspections of the underside. With my Morgans, I know the undersides intimately, so I can soon spot any changes.

The primary risk is abrasion of the protective surface by road debris, which is more than you might imagine. Lots of modern cars have plastic mouldings under the floors, which help to protect the metal.

A good example on Morgans is my exhaust deflector plates. These are simple angled aluminium plates, which I fitted on each exhaust mounting, primarily to stop crud building up there.

The section under each mounting is horizontal. The leading edge is folded up at maybe 30 degrees. After only a few miles, the angled section has been grit blasted by road debris, whereas the horizontal section is hardly marked.

The other feature of Trads is that the body centre section stays clean. Only the wings and running boards take the crud.
It's worth checking the bottom couple of inches under the trailing edge of each rear wing. Here can get blasted down to bare metal very quickly.
Posted By: Arwyn Williams

Re: Too precious towards the car? - 08/12/20 12:01 PM

Use mine all year round.

Never drive it with the hood up either.

Its not made of glass and I've rebuilt once so I can rebuild it again.

Arwyn
Posted By: Saxonian

Re: Too precious towards the car? - 08/12/20 01:51 PM

Must admit, I am leaning towards purchasing some of this stuff :-

Lanoguard

[Linked Image]
Posted By: John V6

Re: Too precious towards the car? - 08/12/20 02:07 PM

Does it flow at ambient temps unlike waxoyl? From their advert it does seem good
Posted By: Hamwich

Re: Too precious towards the car? - 08/12/20 03:24 PM

Originally Posted by Saxonian
Must admit, I am leaning towards purchasing some of this stuff :-

Lanoguard



I've never come across this stuff before but TBH when Bilt Hamber Dynax is available I've never bothered to look at anything else. If it's good enough to protect oil rigs it'll do for the bottom of my Mog.
Posted By: PHZI

Re: Too precious towards the car? - 09/12/20 05:42 AM

Likewise. All Bilt Hamber products come out top in tests/reviews. Underbody, releasing agent, waxes etc etc. Never saw the need to use anything else. Tried a few over the 40 + years of owning classics/hobby cars. In winter, I am careful how I use them. Maximum one month at the outside between drives and try to pick a dry day. I find not using hobby cars daily makes it a more special occasion when I do. I have a couple of workhorse daily drivers, (Volvos) which seem impervious to the ravages of winter roads. I keep my hobby cars as nice as possible but hate washing them!
Posted By: CooperMan

Re: Too precious towards the car? - 09/12/20 09:47 AM

Originally Posted by Viper
I thought I was bad.

If I thought too much about all the above I wouldn’t sleep

Yes, perhaps a little dramatic, but you'd be surprised what's corroding in hidden spots, DW's comments above of regular inspection are very worthwhile

BTW...I need to point out that I use all my classics all year, this weekend I will be braving a run in the old F Super, no hood even exists, no heater, no shock absorbers, one useless vacuum wiper & currently using hand starter as the bendix is a bit dodgy - but proper old style fun driving it
Posted By: Rovert

Re: Too precious towards the car? - 09/12/20 09:52 AM

Originally Posted by Saxonian
Must admit, I am leaning towards purchasing some of this stuff :-

Lanoguard

[Linked Image]


Seems to be getting good reviews In Land Rover circles but another Bilt Hamber user here.

Oh and do not get too complacent about aluminium, the biggest issues on both of my Defenders (and the Morgan) have been related to the ali.
Posted By: Viper

Re: Too precious towards the car? - 09/12/20 08:02 PM

I have Sploshed both Dynatrol and Bilt hamber on the rear crossmember of my woman’s defender ever since new. I find they both dry up and crack during summer months
Posted By: howard

Re: Too precious towards the car? - 09/12/20 08:53 PM

Originally Posted by Budster
About 3,000 miles a year for me. I try to avoid salted roads in winter, but really enjoy winter drives.
I’ve never thought of my 4/4 as an investment, but it is nice that depreciation is negligible.

As a friend once said: “having a beautiful car and not using it, for fear of depreciation; is a bit like having a beautiful girlfriend and not making love, for fear of spoiling her for her next boyfriend!”
innocent

Bud
4/4 - Stanley


But hang on! Surely in car terms a Trad, being a pretty old model, is more of a case of someone's granny. Is your friend into Grab a Granny Night down at the local? slap
Mind you one of our cars definitely comes into the "old banger" category.

Mind you your pals line of argument is the same one I use when explaining why I prefer a Fezza to a Porker. Its a bit like comparing Sophia Loren with Angela Merkel. One is attractive. The other is reliable.
Posted By: Clipper

Re: Too precious towards the car? - 09/12/20 08:56 PM

Originally Posted by RBW
Evening All

Hope we are all well,

I've seen a few classics (VW Transporter MK1, Hillman Avenger, Ford Capri MK1, Jaguar S Type) in use this weekend on the heavily salted and wet roads in my area, which got me thinking.

My Morgan is now effectively off road until next year due to the weather etc, I don't drive it in the rain unless its unavoidable, I also get unsure when its heavily overcast. And as soon as salt appears that marks the end of the driving year.

I know many would say it's just a car and to enjoy it, but its not just any car if that makes sense? I normsally manage around 3000 miles a year.

However as a debate point - Am I being too precious towards it?

Thoughts welcome as always!


I am going to be brutal and honest.

Most of us are of a certain age age and are much nearer the end than the beginning.

Stop worrying about the f***ing car - just live in the moment and enjoy it and drive it(cold and dry is okay - not a complete maniac)as much as possible before you depart this mortal coil.

All these cars will outlive us and be running about when we are long gone - they are potentially immortal - we are not! Amen.

Am I wrong?

Right - now I have got that off my chest - time for another wine
Posted By: Image

Re: Too precious towards the car? - 09/12/20 09:38 PM

Right in my book .... when the Bank calls you in to review your finances and the advisor tells you to stop saving money and enjoy it instead, you know it's time to push the boat out and live for today!! (Of course, if your Doctor says the same thing then you need to get your skates on!! .... but not got to that one yet) smile

K
Posted By: Ray

Re: Too precious towards the car? - 09/12/20 09:50 PM

Originally Posted by Clipper
Originally Posted by RBW
Evening All

Hope we are all well,

I've seen a few classics (VW Transporter MK1, Hillman Avenger, Ford Capri MK1, Jaguar S Type) in use this weekend on the heavily salted and wet roads in my area, which got me thinking.

My Morgan is now effectively off road until next year due to the weather etc, I don't drive it in the rain unless its unavoidable, I also get unsure when its heavily overcast. And as soon as salt appears that marks the end of the driving year.

I know many would say it's just a car and to enjoy it, but its not just any car if that makes sense? I normsally manage around 3000 miles a year.

However as a debate point - Am I being too precious towards it?

Thoughts welcome as always!


I am going to be brutal and honest.

Most of us are of a certain age age and are much nearer the end than the beginning.

Stop worrying about the f***ing car - just live in the moment and enjoy it and drive it(cold and dry is okay - not a complete maniac)as much as possible before you depart this mortal coil.

All these cars will outlive us and be running about when we are long gone - they are potentially immortal - we are not! Amen.

Am I wrong?

Right - now I have got that off my chest - time for another wine
. I think you hit the nail on the head enjoy what you can while you can,the next owner may trash it.
Posted By: Jon G4LJW

Re: Too precious towards the car? - 09/12/20 10:16 PM

Originally Posted by Ray
Originally Posted by Clipper
Originally Posted by RBW
Evening All

Hope we are all well,

I've seen a few classics (VW Transporter MK1, Hillman Avenger, Ford Capri MK1, Jaguar S Type) in use this weekend on the heavily salted and wet roads in my area, which got me thinking.

My Morgan is now effectively off road until next year due to the weather etc, I don't drive it in the rain unless its unavoidable, I also get unsure when its heavily overcast. And as soon as salt appears that marks the end of the driving year.

I know many would say it's just a car and to enjoy it, but its not just any car if that makes sense? I normsally manage around 3000 miles a year.

However as a debate point - Am I being too precious towards it?

Thoughts welcome as always!


I am going to be brutal and honest.

Most of us are of a certain age age and are much nearer the end than the beginning.

Stop worrying about the f***ing car - just live in the moment and enjoy it and drive it(cold and dry is okay - not a complete maniac)as much as possible before you depart this mortal coil.

All these cars will outlive us and be running about when we are long gone - they are potentially immortal - we are not! Amen.

Am I wrong?

Right - now I have got that off my chest - time for another wine
. I think you hit the nail on the head enjoy what you can while you can,the next owner may trash it.


+1

xmashappy
Posted By: John V6

Re: Too precious towards the car? - 09/12/20 10:58 PM

+2
Posted By: +8Rich

Re: Too precious towards the car? - 09/12/20 11:06 PM

+3

Quite how anybody could think otherwise after the events of this year beats me....
Posted By: Luddite

Re: Too precious towards the car? - 09/12/20 11:36 PM

RAMBLE ALERT...

Jeez guys I have no idea of how much I have typed on this very subject, on the MSCC DG and eMog, perhaps on NBC also...(-:

I suspect there are very many different factors that can be used to justify and influence any given point of view, in that there will be so many varied backgrounds relative to classic car owners of any marque..?

Unfortunately my Grandfathers did not have the wherewithal to own a Bugatti or any motor car let alone have somewhere to let it lie gathering dust... NOT that I envy those who were fortunate to inherit stunning machines or much else. I enjoyed all the processes of acquiring my own machines and in some cases a bit at a time, such were the financial constraints of the time, a process which required me to learn to be as self reliant as possible over very many years, and learning as many skills as possible to be able to keep my old machinery on the road, no tinternet back then for sure.... With all that and more in mind, my thinking on this particular subject has evolved over many years.

My yoof was spent passing time polishing whatever m/cycle I had at the time, untill the engine gleamed and keeping it that way, mileage limited by petrol costs. I started out dreaming of all the tricky bits related to m/cycle tuning and modification available in the 60`s while polishing the internals of an engine that was nearly as old as me, not exactly a garage queen, butwith an engine polished within an inch of it`s life, the m/cycle lived under a tarpaulin parked outside in the road...

Tuning, you bet, in time I was well into that, with my uncle an ex m/cycle racer, suggesting that if you want a faster machine, then buy one that was initially designed to be faster, for modifying a less performant machine bit at a time will ever upset the balance of the original design... How right he was, and it was not until I bought my first 60`s Lotus Elan that I began to better understand that which he was trying to teach me.... Though the Lotus I bought had been modified beyond which it should have been and suffered accordingly, but you hopefully get my drift in that my first car was a Frogeye Sprite which I..err..tuned, compare that to the lovely Twink of an Elan with discs all round thus a whole lot different from the somewhat less than ideal design and the components used to create an AH Sprite..?

Many machines later I came in search of a Morgan experience, by which time my thinking had evolved to prioritise originality, having come from 911s, I had by then learned that Porsche engineers new how to create a reliable sports car that could out perform most. For sure Morgan engineering standards were accepted as less than top quality and that I would have to compromise some degree of engineering qualities to find happiness in Morgan ownership, but then that was considered to be part of the Morganeering experience, foibles and all..and having spent a couple of years or so on the Morgan sites, I knew well what I was in for before I even considered parting with my cash.

I had over the years read of the build quality, of`t times compounded by home mechanics over-tuning one or other aspect of the car and ruining whatever balance had been made available by the MMC in the first place..? One has only to type in the word overheating into a search engine, to know that tuning an old TR engine is perhaps not the best idea if you are seeking reliability, balance is all, was my thinking and Morgans seemed likely to display foibles when they were new, add a bit of home mechanic fettling for fun and the result could be no fun if your priority was to enjoy driving your Morgan...? Of course there are many Morganeers who have tuned much and in the process have created wonderfully reliable and performant Morgans, which may be outnumbered by some degree by those less enjoyed by owners as the result of mad modifications...?

Modification was more often than not discouraged by me for folks who had little knowledge of the likely end product.

Justification of improving the quality of a Classic...? Well some such cars are pretty well designed, which is perhaps why I ended up buying three air cooled Porsches and running them one after another for a decade or so, before thinking I would like to sample a bit more of a raw driving experience by way of a Vintage car with a fair degree of performance, budget ever being a limiting factor,a Morgan as opposed to a Bentely seemed to be THE ideal machine... which proved it`s self to be.

Originality...? Well having learned the lesson of imbalance, I was not in search of any unreliable practically undrivable fire breathing machine, but also not searching for something entirely original, with original corrosion issues lying in wait under freshly applied paint. At a time of me contemplating which Morgan the GoMog webmaster told me I must buy this Morgan, which turned out to be Kevin`s +8... Knowing quality workmanship when I saw it I arranged to buy it on the spot, no argument on price given the quality Kevin had built in..... But...It was NOT original, and had been modified to take tubular shockers on the rear, Koni adjustables on the front, Areoquip brake lines the tank chassis rad bulkheads etc finished in high gloss two pack black lacquer with SS fixings used wherever possible, and all the usual corrosion areas given extra attention during the rebuild, thus a perhaps in the minds of some a tad too much over restored to be considered original, though the engine and running gear was indeed still standard and thus likely to be reliable, which it has proved it`s self to be in the circa 18 years in my ownership...(-:

As you may have read elsewhere I am in the process of replacing some of the "original" parts of my exhaust system with SS, thus my original thinking on originality has been sacrificed to quality improvements to some degree (-:

As for determining the way others should enjoy their Morgans or any other classics.... ? I suspect a garage queen can be equally valued by an owner as much as another owner enjoys covering as many miles possible, each to their own. I know one car polished to perfection which had covered more miles than most, and restored as and when necessary, and polished all over again year on year, the theory that polished metal survives better than paintwork when subjected to high mileages.... Works for me.

As for an old dog compared to a concours queen, I have before related the story of a tired old Mog that had been to Alaska and back, turning up at a US Morgan event where the majority of the cars may have been in perfect condition or better... The old dog was removed from the parking lot and given pride of place in the foyer of the fancy hotel. Seems when perfection is the norm, then something out of the ordinary trumps it all...? (-:

Another interesting contribution I remember existed on GoMoG and seems likely to have come from the pen of the webmaster there, and kinda described the value of a Morgan that could perhaps be applied to the many and varied owners of Morgans regardless of the variables of their Morgans condition. I suspect that page would be worth finding and posting on here, Lorne sure had a way with words, no doubt still has..(-:.

Ultimately I suspect cars will carry their own history with them, Mine was as perfect as it could be and I took it up a rough unmade road on the second day of ownership with stones flying. Recently I have have spent quite a few bob to replace corroding bits with SS. In my ownership my +8 has been both a tourer covering a fair bit of mileage over short periods of time, and for the majority of it`s life it has been sitting under a cover in my garage which explains its low mileage relative to it`s age, circa 8k miles when I bought it and now circa 40k.. it has acquired a used look, or patina if preferred...(-: It is a used and enjoyed machine, we have a history together and it provides a degree of enjoyment every time I see it sitting in my garage.

VALUE of a Morgan..? Well now we can wax lyrical about patinated old Morgans, but it seems to me that perhaps when it comes to the average purchase of any classic, that a buyer seems likely to use every sign of much valued patination accrued by the owner as another bargaining "chip" in his bid to reduce the asking price and once bought the new owner will present whatever patina exists as that which records the machines important and much valued history..... rofl
Posted By: JohnHarris

Re: Too precious towards the car? - 10/12/20 01:18 PM

This is my 3rd Morgan with a nearly 25 year break after my second, its interesting to relate the changes that have occurred in the intervening years to the build quality and materials used to help preserve the cars better and my own relative enjoyment of the different cars.

My first Morgan was a 1985 4/4 five years old when I acquired it with only 5k miles in immaculate condition with chrome wire wheels, heavily specified as it was the Times competition prize car. The days before galvanised chassis, I don't think the woodwork was treated and the wings were painted on the body leading to the wing beads being painted, it had aluminium wings with steel body. it was an immaculate car, that I spent more time cleaning than actually enjoying driving and every time I returned from a run, I would find the body flexing would crack the paint covering the bead and need touching up. It drove me too distraction and masked some of my enjoyment of the car. On a very wet trip across the west of Ireland, I had water rushing backwards and forwards over the floorboards as I accelerated or braked, water pouring in from everywhere, vo much so we wore wax cottons inside the car, it got so wet inside that when I got home I had to lift all the padding to dry it out as there was no wood preservative.....too much time and energy to keep it in pristine condition it outweighed the joy of ownership...so I quickly sold it to purchase my second Morgan a 1977 4/4 4 seater Molly which was only 15 years old and 50k miles clocked.

Molly was showing her age a bit, the paintwork was tidy but tired it had a few aluminium blisters on the bodywork and wings , the inner wings had corrosion (would need replacing) the chassis was tired and had corrosion, there was some driver door drop, so wood work questionable in places, it leaked exhaust fumes into the cabin on fast runs as only the 4 seaters of those days could...only slightly reduced by putting a exhaust tail pipe extension. I ran that as my everyday car for 3 years, in the snow and ice, travelled as far as Austria in it and loved ever minute of it. Only sold it because the chassis and inner wings were going to fail its next MOT and the guys that bought it with the intention of rebuilding it, I saw it after the rebuild and they did a great job

Now by contrast my current Morgan 2006 4/4 was 14 years old 26k miles in very good but not pristine condition, the important areas like the chassis, woodwork, inner wings, bulkhead are either galvanised, treated or in better materials like stainless steel than the previous Morgans and I believe will make it easier to maintain its condition over time. The first 4 months or so of ownership have been really enjoyable, not without some small incidences, but I feel the car will not be as demanding to maintain as the 85............and in much better condition than the similarly aged 1977 4 seater I thoroughly enjoyed owning as I could be less precious about it.........


regards




Posted By: +8Rich

Re: Too precious towards the car? - 10/12/20 04:38 PM


From one of the boys in Italy today xmashappy

[Linked Image]
Posted By: Hamwich

Re: Too precious towards the car? - 10/12/20 06:42 PM

Of course, if you really enjoy your motoring to the full:

[Linked Image]
Posted By: +8Rich

Re: Too precious towards the car? - 11/12/20 10:59 PM


Todays update from Italy, these boys don't mess around clap

[Linked Image]
Posted By: DaveW

Re: Too precious towards the car? - 11/12/20 11:12 PM

^^That's not Craig is it?
Posted By: +8Rich

Re: Too precious towards the car? - 11/12/20 11:28 PM

snowcool I think he's got clear indicators ?
Posted By: Craig Jezz

Re: Too precious towards the car? - 11/12/20 11:34 PM

Originally Posted by DaveW
^^That's not Craig is it?


Nah it mine Dave, I ain’t washed my car since 2017, no need it doesn’t get dirty does it hide


[Linked Image]
Posted By: RobCol

Re: Too precious towards the car? - 12/12/20 02:38 PM

Originally Posted by Craig Jezz
Originally Posted by DaveW
^^That's not Craig is it?


Nah it mine Dave, I ain’t washed my car since 2017, no need it doesn’t get dirty does it hide



I bet you've been round it a few times with a feather duster Craig
carrot
Posted By: Themorganeer

Re: Too precious towards the car? - 13/12/20 08:57 PM

Originally Posted by RobCol
Originally Posted by Craig Jezz
Originally Posted by DaveW
^^That's not Craig is it?


Nah it mine Dave, I ain’t washed my car since 2017, no need it doesn’t get dirty does it hide



I bet you've been round it a few times with a feather duster Craig
carrot


Said the actress to the Bishop 😇
Posted By: Luddite

Re: Too precious towards the car? - 14/12/20 08:14 AM

Too precious about one`s Morgan...? As one much wiser than I may have decreed "Everything is relative..? " I suppose if a Morgan purchase involves little more than pocket change, it may be enjoyed in whichever way one chooses then replaced with another when the mood so determines, I have no problem with that.

My Morgan at the time of purchase swallowed up the equivalent of five years of savings to cover it`s cost, thus there was a degree of preciousness involved from the outset, and perhaps more so given the time and effort Kevin had put into it`s conversion to concours condition was well recognised by me, given I had more than once tried to restore my various old sports cars to that degree of quality, without ever getting there..sigh..!

Regardless of the above, I ragged my Morgan up an unmade road on the second day of ownership, and have used it to tour some of Southern Europe on holiday trips taking on some rough roads, but for much of it`s time with me it has been more of an unintended garage queen due to other priorities in life taking over, and perhaps more so as the result of acquiring stiff this that and the other with the passage of time (Me, not my Morgan) smile....and cleaning the underside is a tad more difficult and time consuming than once it was, so I find that between lousy weather and Covid, rare is the opportunity to fire the old thing up at a time when I really should, before I am denied the opportunity to do so for whatever reason might appear over the horizon...Precious it still is, even though in reality it has more than paid for it`s self on my books... smile

Deriving pleasure from ownership of a Morgan or other classic can be found in so many different ways, The likes of the GoMoG webmaster, and Bill Button and others covered a few miles in their Morgans and on different continents, but not everyone can manage that level of adventure, and there will be others that were bought with the idea of Morganeering adventures having read of those who have gone before, but ended up as garage queens for many and varied reasons... Shrug... There would seem to be many less adventurous routes found in the enjoyment of a Morgan..? Each to their own seems to be a reasonable outlook...?
Posted By: Neilda

Re: Too precious towards the car? - 14/12/20 01:03 PM

I have owned a few exotic cars over the years, and they were most definitely garage queens - very precious things to be looked at and occasionally driven.

My Morgan is a little different. I won't go out if it's raining and going to stay wet all day. What's the point? But if it's not raining when I set out, then I'll use it.

But I would add that for me, driving a shiny and clean car is part of the pleasure. Therefore mine is currently on SORN until the spring as I just can't see any pleasure in driving around muddy wet roads in a Morgan - I have a Range Rover for that... and maybe next year, a Tesla! smile
Posted By: Peter J

Re: Too precious towards the car? - 14/12/20 04:25 PM

Neil,

it is a much, much faster job to wash, dry and polish the Plus 8 than the Range Rover...
Tarka is not a garage queen, more a bit of a dandy....

Peter
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