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gomog #11866 26/11/07 08:21 PM
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NGUNS!!
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Originally Posted By gomog

...

On residuals, some dealers and owners have recently addressed the company to find ways of keeping the Aero residuals more buoyant. 40% in 2 years is not unusual. http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayIS...em=150183212893

...

Lorne


Am I missing something here? a $76k return, at auction (and an Ebay auction at that) after 2 years on an original retail price of $120k (pls correct me if I am wrong as I'm working from memory here) equates to a residual of 65% not 40%, which is excellent in anyones book.

Of course I appreciate it does not compare to the 'good old days'.

All I will say about the days of old when you got back what you paid, was that you had to wait 6 years for a new car. 12 months is more than enough in my book and I would definitely not be bothered if that were the current waiting list.

Everything you enjoy costs money. I am prepared to pay for my fun, though of course slowing the depreciation down is desirable smile

BtG

Last edited by Boshly; 26/11/07 08:23 PM.

Cheers

BtG
Boshly #11870 26/11/07 08:30 PM
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I think much of this conversation is down to individual reality (I cannot think of the right word... I'll blame it on being a long day! read )

What I mean by this is: non-Morgan owners (who are realistic in their expectations when buying a car [any car, not just a Morgan]) are prepared to loose 50% of the MSRP on a vehicle over 3-years.

It just so happens that Morgans have faired (at times) much better than this rough industry average; therefore, some long-term Morgan owners will remember days of 90-100% (if not a premium in some cases!) residual value. This must warp their perception of the second hand car market. Where as many of us take a 50% loss as a given and the trade-off for our love of 4-wheeled beauties, they find it hard to grasp based on the strong values the brand could command in the past.

I'd love to believe an Aero 8 or a Roadster V6 will retain more than 50% of it's value after 3-years but I just don't see this as reality.

(I also fear - and won't go too far into this because it borders on the philosophical - that in a society where most material items seem to be becoming easier to justify disposing of (when they are still perfectly good) that it is not just a trend within the Morgan world but across most industries).

Boshly #11871 26/11/07 08:32 PM
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Originally Posted By Boshly
Am I missing something here? a $76k return, at auction (and an Ebay auction at that) after 2 years on an original retail price of $120k (pls correct me if I am wrong as I'm working from memory here) equates to a residual of 65% not 40%, which is excellent in anyones book.

Of course I appreciate it does not compare to the 'good old days'.
BtG


Andy - good to have your different perspective as a new to Morgans man rather then those with a longer experience of the make. thumbs

Despite what traditionally has been the case it's still very good compared with other makes (or is it...anyone know about Ferrari/Masser/Porsche. etc) coffee


Phil Egginton
1979 4/4 4 seater
Boshly #11872 26/11/07 08:32 PM
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Oh dear, I take it its fat chance for me selling my Aero at a premium then... doh grin2

Last edited by kin; 26/11/07 08:33 PM.

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Ditto Simon


Phil Egginton
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Originally Posted By SpeedMog
Despite what traditionally has been the case it's still very good compared with other makes (or is it...anyone know about Ferrari/Masser/Porsche. etc) coffee


A Porsche 911 will retain roughly 60% of the purchase price (not including silly options like extended leather, etc) over 3-years.

Lamborghinis are VERY bad because Lamborghini only provide a 2-year warranty with their Murciélago and (as of 2006) a 3-year on the Gallardo. These are non-extendable with Lamborghini (and after market warranties at £50.00 labour per hour (on a car that needs £200.00+ per hour) are not even worth the paper they are printed on.

So, Lambos drop quickly at first, then seem to level out at 50% after year 3 but the 1st and 2nd years are painful (£25,000+ per year drops).

Ferrari are better because you can extended the factory warranty; however, as they require heavy servicing, this also tends to affect residual value. Even so, 50% after 3-years on V8 models (V12s loose more) isn't too far from reality.

Maserati pantsdown ...but with improved build quality on the GT, this may change. I believe Rich (and a few others) have owned the 3000 and 3200, so they will be able to give you a real world account of how quickly these cars loose money.

A big problem with the brands mentioned above (excluding the 911 because of the MSRP) are not what they are worth after 3-years but just how much a 50% loss is. For instance, if you paid £200,000 for a Murciélago and after 3-years, you were offered £100,000, that is £2,775 loss a month, not including all the running costs. So while 50% residual value may not sound too bad - it's still a lot of money.

Hence the crux, the more you spend, the more you loose!

Simon #11876 26/11/07 08:42 PM
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So 50% after three years looks to be pretty good or at least on par within the peer group thumbs

englandwave


Phil Egginton
1979 4/4 4 seater
Boshly #11878 26/11/07 08:51 PM
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Originally Posted By gomog
on residuals, some dealers and owners have recently addressed the company to find ways of keeping the Aero residuals more buoyant. 40% in 2 years is not unusual. http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayIS...em=150183212893
Lorne

Originally Posted By Boshly
Am I missing something here? a $76k return, at auction (and an Ebay auction at that) after 2 years on an original retail price of $120k (pls correct me if I am wrong

Sure. Happy to help. (120-76)/120 = 37% loss. The other Aero 2005 (with 600 miles) I mentioned was being sold privately for 60k USD a few weeks ago. (120-60)/120 = 50% loss.

Originally Posted By Boshly
you had to wait 6 years for a new car. 12 months is more than enough in my book and I would definitely not be bothered if that were the current waiting list.

I would.

Originally Posted By gomog
Everything you enjoy costs money. I am prepared to pay for my fun, BtG

Absolutely agree. I have paid more than a new Aero on each of my cars. Love them both. I have no budget when it comes to Morgans.

However, others do (in a special way). As I have said before, the key to Morgan (a tiny company in a tiny rural village making a very expensive quixotic car) being in business for the last 4-5 decades is that the risks of buying one were balanced away by fact that you couldn't lose more than fuel, road tax and insurance...and you could often make money on your fun. That is still the case in many countries. It is still the case with some models in your country.

Lorne


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Originally Posted By SpeedMog
Why dont we start with the specific example of North America?

We can do that. It is a shorter and a very specific example but interesting nonetheless. Actually, its history started pre-1999.

However, do we really want to try this? Some seem uncomfortable with the subject matter. We can continue off-group if you wish.

Lorne


gomog #11889 27/11/07 07:07 AM
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Originally Posted By gomog
However, do we really want to try this? Some seem uncomfortable with the subject matter. We can continue off-group if you wish.


Perhaps not then because a more relevant debate to all is growing.....

Originally Posted By gomog
However, others do (in a special way). As I have said before, the key to Morgan (a tiny company in a tiny rural village making a very expensive quixotic car) being in business for the last 4-5 decades is that the risks of buying one were balanced away by fact that you couldn't lose more than fuel, road tax and insurance...and you could often make money on your fun. That is still the case in many countries. It is still the case with some models in your country.


So the issue at heart seems to be the relative viewpoints on residuals.....

I suggest we carry on this track then ....


Phil Egginton
1979 4/4 4 seater
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