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Its all very well being anti this and anti that but ...someone has to put the lid on this and sort this country out and there aren't any anti's who will do the job now , 'rats leaving a sinking ship ' and all that !


Geneva 2016 plus 8' The Green Godess' 4 side exits .


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I voted in back in the 70's. Recently I remember seeing info about the Gov of the time Heath era ( but previous also with Wilson era), suppressing details re the long term move towards a federal europe as that was going to frighten people into a No vote when all politicians wante In.
Looking at the Brexit referendum nothing has really changed with both sides playing on nationalism and fear with a shying away from factual info.


Plus Four MY23 Furka Rouge
tmg513 #374346 01/07/16 05:08 PM
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Originally Posted By tmg513
Originally Posted By sospan
It looks like the behind the scenes manouvering is in full swing!
Scupper Boris to leave the " preferred" contender with an easier route?
Was Gove promised a position if he knifed Boris?


I doubt it as May and Gove loathe each other from all accounts. What a day yesterday: Johnson was a PM in waiting at breakfast and by lunchtime his career was in ruins. Great stuff.


May could well have taken the view of playing up to Gove as a short term expediency. Get others to make offers that could be reneged on. Remember...they are politicians, most of whom have no scruples.


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Originally Posted By Gambalunga
So who is going to pick up the poisoned chalice* now?

Boris Johnson rules himself out of Tory leadership race

I don't feel qualified to comment on this but I would be interested to hear what other people think.

*
Originally Posted By http://idioms.thefreedictionary.com
a poisoned chalice (British)
something that harms the person it is given to although it seemed very good when they first got it. The leadership of the party turned out to be a poisoned chalice.


Hasn't anybody noticed? The U.K. might have a TM er as the next PM er. wink what will TM's policy be on MMC? These and other important questions should be answered ASAP. coffee


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The UK may not be "flavour of the month" in the EU at the moment but at least we dont have any nasty far right groups at risk of being elected.

UKIP are pussycats compared to some of these groups in other EU countries and they only have one seat anyway.

It's the left that are presently causing a bit of parliamentary turmoil. redcard


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Clipper #374379 01/07/16 07:22 PM
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Originally Posted By Clipper
The UK may not be "flavour of the month" in the EU at the moment but at least we dont have any nasty far right groups at risk of being elected.

UKIP are pussycats compared to some of these groups in other EU countries and they only have one seat anyway.



A politician murdered on the street for her political beliefs? Racist violence against others in the EU? Sometimes it pays to take a reality check. The far right is to be found under many acronyms.


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MarioCP #374392 01/07/16 08:32 PM
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Originally Posted By MarioCP


Wow! The sentence combining grannies and selling comes to mind. His surname includes the first four letters of 'Government' - observation. Sounds like that husband and wife team are pretty toxic.


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Clipper #374413 01/07/16 10:09 PM
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Originally Posted By Clipper
The UK may not be "flavour of the month" in the EU at the moment but at least we dont have any nasty far right groups at risk of being elected.

UKIP are pussycats compared to some of these groups in other EU countries and they only have one seat anyway.

It's the left that are presently causing a bit of parliamentary turmoil. redcard

UKIP actually has 24 elected members in the European Parliament. It is a strange fact that a party contrary to the existence of the EU has the most seats (Labour 20 and Conservative 19). Do they renounce their lucrative pay and conditions, of course not, they are happy to take the money whilst doing their best to undermine the very organsition that gives them such a good living. If they had any morals at all they would now resign as a block and let those who wish to see the EU continue to function get on with it.

They don't have any barrels of gunpowder but they might as well have for all the harm that they have done.

As I learn more of the story behind the story it is showing more and more that politicians are a nasty bunch of self serving individuals and very few, if any, of them can be trusted.

I hope this is not the best that democracy has to offer.


Peter

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DaveW #374424 02/07/16 04:26 AM
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Originally Posted By DaveW
Originally Posted By The Austrian
DaveW
Seems that you are a supporter of the peoples right to get away from EU. Now the EU is following the decision of the UK voters and you think that is not correct? What kind of democratic decision fits you most?



Yes, I'm old school. When I voted for a free trade European alliance way back in the seventies, there was no mention of Federalisation by stealth, nor continuous expansion to encompass 28 nations. The European Parliament is awash with corruption, croneyism, and self serving bureaucrats on huge salaries.
Why do we need another layer?

By the same token we have Scottish MP's in Westminster and another layer in Holyrood.
Why do we need two layers............

Obviously Westminster is a smaller version of the same thing but some of these MPs can be voted out if they don't hold safe seats.

There's a huge amount wrong with UK democracy. First past the post denies many voters any influence.
Farage scared Cameron into promising a referendum, and Cameron thought he could win. Cameron is out of touch with ordinary voters and certainly in South Yorkshire where we live there's a huge anti-EU (and anti-Cameron) feeling.

This is tied up with over supply of cheap labour combined with minimum wage and zero hours contracts.
So this is what has played out. It's a huge protest vote against politicians both here and in the EU parliament.

And we can see from the chaos which has ensued that nobody was expecting it and nobody wants to take it forward.

This is only the beginning - wait until the next General Election in the UK.
I can also see other member states working towards exit...
.....I would like to see PR in the UK, and a single layer of parliament. But this doesn't accord with devolution.


+ 1

Well argued Dave. Pretty much agree with all you say here.

Cheers


Jeremy

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