Talk Morgan Forums Community Welcome Forum 1970 Plus 8 R7242 from Japan to the Netherlands

Hi Everyone,

I am Arjen and acquired this summer Plus 8 R7242. It spent all its live in Japan and is still in a very good condition for its age. Although I just quited the prewar race scene, and am used to antique gear boxes, the Moss box is already sitting on a shelf in my garage.
I am planning to change for a Tremec T5.

Anyone has experience to share with me doing this to an early plus 8?
I see several companies offering bellhousings.

However I spotted one picture on the web of an American plus 4 with a T5 mated to the Original magnesium bell housing. This would have my preference.
However would this be compatible to an upgrade to 4.6 for the engine?

Thanks and I wish everyone already a very Moggy 2017

Arjen

Welcome to TalkMorgan, Arjen ! I'm sorry I cannot help you with your query about replacing the gearbox, but I'm sure someone will be along soon with some helpful advice. Enjoy your 2017 when you get the car as you want it.

Hello Arjen

Before I go into some technical details , I am going to ask the question why you want to do this? A lot of the character of the early +8 is encapsulated in the gearbox , that may be one of the reasons they are referred to as "Moss Box +8s"

As well as the character the fitment of an non-original box will destroy the value of the car , and render it illegible for any historic racing. The Moss Box can be built by Billy Bellinger into an all-syncromesh affair (at a price), and I would strongly advise trying out one of these first.

Coming from other pre-war cars you must be familiar with double declutching, and used this way the Moss Box will give you a very good (if not exactly delightful) change. True it will never be a rifle bolt action, but this is part of the skill set you need to drive this car well.

If you want to change boxes then by far the easiest route is to use the LT77 , or R380 from the later +8s. The latter will cope well with the additional torque of the 4.6 engine , the former less so. However I would strongly advise against the 4.6 route unless you want a "Drag Racer" . A fully modified 3.5 litre engine will produce 250 to 280 bhp and be nicer to drive , more balanced handling, and still eligible for historic racing. You can four-wheel-drift a 3.5 car (wherever it is safe to do so) under perfect control as long as you skill set is up to it. A modified 4.6 will produce so much torque that it becomes quite a handful, especially in the wet.

If you are determined to go down the T5 or similar route then I believe that John Eales does a bell housing to suit , but don't underestimate the amount of work involved in this conversion.

I apologise if I appear to sound a trifle negative about your plans, but the Moss Box cars are very special , you are lucky to have found a good one, so I would be strongly advising that you talk to many other owners before going down your proposed route.

Welcome to TM Arjen I hope you enjoy your time here I have a 1999 +8 with the 3.9 engine and R380 gearbox with 31,000miles on both and it is a nice gearbox and suited to the torque of the V8. Not a gearbox to be rushed similar in that way to the Moss box.

Good luck with your project.

There is a lot of historical useful information on the site below.
http://www.gomog.com/allmorgan/allmorgan.html

Wishing you a Happy New Year.

Welcome from downunder and look forward to hearing more on this project.

Welcome to TM Arjen

Although i am not a huge fan of the moss box, i do beeive you will the character of your plus 8 if you change it for a later box.
As Andy suggests, why not consider having your existing box rebuit with today's modifications.

Thanks Everyone!

I am fully aware of the Moss pedigree. A part from the engine the rest of the car is in such shape it does not need a full restoration. So I was planning to shelf the matching number engine and gearbox and change for a T5 (I have already learned R380's are next to impossible to find). Once a turnkey engine in the car I was planning to attend to the engine in all calmness of the next couple of years. The prewar cars I was driving mostly alone. Whilst test driving Morgan's my better half and daughter commented "I could drive this!" Than this early Plus 8 opportunity came along delivering me this Moss dilemma Moss Box dilemma......So I need to secure initially the car changes gears easily.

I have sent John Eales a mail in the meantime

Arjen

Arjen,

There are many suppliers of secondhand or rebuilt R380 gearboxes - I know you would have to transport it though.

http://www.for-sale.co.uk/r380-gearbox

http://www.ashcroft-transmissions.co.uk/manual-gearboxes.html

Just ideas.

You should be aware that this is not a simple modification
The pedal crossmember will need modifying substantially as will the centre panel of the bulkhead.
The gearbox crossmember is in the wrong place, and the floors will also need modifying (they are steel on 1970 models)
The transmission cover is a very different shape and won't fit over the t5 gearbox, and the gear-lever is in the wrong place. The handbrake lever will no longer fit and will also need to be changed
That's just off the top of my head...

I would urge you to try one of Billy Bellingers full synchro Moss box conversions, they are almost rifle bolt precise, and very nice to drive with

Simon @ Sifab.co.uk

I agree completely with Andy's comments. If you wish to go down the route of a large capacity, T5 gearbox Plus Eight, you are starting with the wrong car.

The chassis is narrower and different from the 5 speed Plus Eights, the track is narrower and the wheels narrower also.

If you have bought a one owner, Moss boxed car and wish to effect the changes you describe, you will destroy the value. A later car will provide a better base to start from.

However, it's your car and your choice.