Talk Morgan Forums Morgan Sports Cars Classic Morgans (pre-CX) Monty Takes A Deep Breath

Dave,

It must become a case of deminishing returns on £'s spend as you chase the extra BHP. The real acid test is the performance and enjoyment of the car on the road and it seems you have been extremely successfull.

I've always beleived that straight thru exhausts whilst they can increase high range BHP, they can reduce mid range torque. So I asked AI and it came up with this.

A straight-through exhaust will generally not improve low-end or mid-range torque on a naturally aspirated 2L Duratec engine, and it can actually cause a noticeable loss in low-speed torque and drivability.While a straight-through exhaust or "straight pipe" design decreases restriction to help peak high-RPM horsepower, naturally aspirated engines heavily rely on exhaust gas velocity and scavenging to pull exhaust gases out of the cylinder during valve overlap.

)How It Affects the 2L Duratec Powerband:Low-to-Mid RPM Torque Loss:

When you remove the catalytic converter, resonators, or mufflers and replace them with a wide, unrestricted straight pipe, the exhaust gas velocity drops significantly. The slower-moving exhaust gases fail to create the negative-pressure "scavenging pulse" needed to help empty the cylinder at low engine speeds, leading to weaker acceleration and a loss in daily driveabilty.

High-RPM Horsepower Gains:

If the vehicle is driven at a sustained high-RPM range (such as on a racetrack), the massive volume of moving gas will benefit from the reduced restriction, yielding a minor 2–5% increase in peak horsepower at the very top of the rev range.

How to Actually Improve Torque on a 2L Duratec

:If you want to maximize torque rather than just making the car louder, focus on an engineered exhaust setup:4-2-1 Exhaust Manifold: Upgrading to a quality, matched-length 4-2-1 header design (such as specialized kits from performance retailers like Retroford) merges the primary tubes in pairs to maximize mid-range scavenging pulses, which preserves and increases torque. : Avoid oversized 3-inch exhaust pipes unless the engine is turbocharged or a highly modified, high-compression build. A 2.5-inch system with straight-through mufflers strikes the optimal balance between high flow and high gas velocity. [ECU Remapping: Modifying the exhaust changes the air-to-fuel ratio and cylinder filling efficiency. Pairing hardware upgrades with a tailored ECU tune is essential to lock in performance gains.

I well remember driving one of the launch edition CX Plus Six cars on a road route with a nice testing mix of typical poor surfaces / newly resurfaced stretches & of course unpredictable potholes, at the time despite all the dealer & journo hype I was not that impressed having just driven the opposite inbound route in my (I thought at the time, well sorted Roadster) so I took the Roadster back out in the same direction as the P6, it actually confirmed that a well sorted Trad can be a very nice Mog to drive, but did need SSL, 5link etc to compete with a CX ride

Jon,

Without question there are some journeys I undertake, I enjoyed them more in my Plus 4 Sport, than my CX, they were usually very smooth surfaces, with broad sweeping bends, where the manual gave the appearance of more control. Then there are other country lanes which are more undulating, with hump back bridges, that without question the CX is a much faster and better controlled ride and doesm't bottoms out unlike the trads. On motorways or fast dual carriages without question the CV wins hands down everytime.

I was even further impressed by a new CX Plus Four, with active suspension and traction control that felt much more planted than my CX

All great points, and it's fantastic to see the debate come alive

All I'd say is, if I wanted a perfect handling Teutonic machine with a hewn from solid feel, I'd be driving a modern Porsche 911, but TBH I can't think of anything more dull.

The thrill with a traditional chassis Morgan comes directly from your exposure to the environment, and the challenge of mastering its many failings,.

Personally I like a car that has the capacity to scare the living bejesus out of me! How else do you know you're still alive, unless you play a quick game of Tag with the Grim Reaper from time to time?

Have fun, but stay safe out there chaps

Have to agree re.the stiff chassis option of modern car. however its that sublime drive and feedback that the classic gives on a good road surface that for me cannot be replicated by the latest designs. So the mog is a toy to be enjoyed for what it is and give you that smile..... yes I'll say it, that nothing else has managed to give me. I have driven many classics and never had that Morgan experience.

What's the answer then? Well one of each I suppose. trad for when you're feeling robust and everything is right and a CX when you want the car to do a little more. Now in my case that would cause a divorce! and then no mog at all!

Trad Trad Trad Trad Trad Trad Trad

At the risk of repeating myself……🤣 there is nothing like it (now)…
If you’ve got one…… cherish it…… drive it….. there won’t be any more….☹️
It’s all too easy in a modern sports car, but in a trad, you’re just part of it… for better or worse, warts and all….
I’ve done the ‘fast car’ thing…. but they're missing the point….. even my diesel 5 series is waaaaay quicker than my 4/4…..(and more comfortable, practical, sensible 🤣) but it’s not………. fun….!

I don’t mind a bit of chassis flex, it adds to the suspension, it wouldn’t be the same with sliding pillar, leaf springs and a super stiff chassis….. perhaps on track it might help……. but pottering round the back lanes of the Home Counties…..🤦🏻‍♂️🤷🏼‍♂️NO…..

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I do SO agree. I happily admire all the upgrades and read a thread like this with much interest, but for me, at my age, my 4/4 which is clearly far from the fastest, far from the most comfortable et. etc., remains the only car I still take the longest route to and from my destination (which is mostly my heart rehab class!). Hopeless I may be but coaxing my mog around and the "work of art"ness of it makes it simply the best.

There in lies the difference Nick and Juilian, the CX is IMHO better at everything than a trad and that's why mine is my daily driver, I actually as a result spend more time behind the wheel of a Morgan because of that. Experience the joy of Morgan driving all year round, roof up or down. So I've not lost anything in the transistion to a CX I've actually gained far more time in a Morgan.

Other than in the early 90's when I used my Morgan as my everyday car, I've always had another car and the Morgan was a plaything, a weekend cruise or whatever........my CX is far from that, its used rain or shine, in the depths of winter or on the hottest summers day thanks to the efficient airconditioning.........I've not lost anthing in the transistion from a trad to the CX, what I've gained is a querky, engaging and highly enjoyable sports car, that loves the country lanes, eats up motorway miles, can cover vast distances with ease. A real quirky sports car.(sans the clutch, which caused me to move on at one point from having a Morgan.) I've gained so much more, less restrictions for me and more freedoms in use..

Yesterday for a bit of devilment, I was playing trafic light grand prixs, and no-one could catch me, I could see them looking at an old fashioned car, that showed all of them a clean pair of heels and I'didn't even have to use sport or sport plus mode and a few tried but they were left in my wake.........couldn't do that in any of my trads especially the roadsters in the slightest damp the wheel spin would be highly embarissing as the axle wound itself up trying. In the CX I was there one minute and then gone, no fuss no wheelspin just gone.

What ever Morgan you drive, just enjoy it for what it is...........but my CX (maybe the stage in life I'm at) has more than enough performance for me, it's one of the few cars where I'm not looking for more power etc. Just good fun,.

Same here!
I had a 1993 4/4 then 2002Plus8. Loved both for driving and hands-on jobs.
I had a jobs list for the Plus8 to future-proof it for longer term ownership. Basically renewing systems that would detriorate with age plus improvements.
A test drive in a manual PlusFour....mrs sospan liked it more than the trad. We tested an auto. The decision was a joint one....she felt more comfortable in the car. I debated the Plus8 plans versus a new (sorted) car. No regrets in changing to CX. Yes, a couple of minor warranty fixes but less time in the garage for maintenance and care. No radiator or brake recall needed. MMC lesson of waiting for owners to test and develope a new model before a serious think on buying.
Mileage driven has increased. Auto mode plus paddle options as I want giving the best of both worlds. Damn good mpg...(shame about the VED tax)
It is a Morgan. A development stage that has always been there with significant changes to structure/design. It's happened before mant times.
3wheeler to Four.
Engine changes ( 4cyl to 8!) , chassis improvements, suspension developments, build quality. Aero tub development with Aero8, Plus8. Improved build quality.

I absolutely agree, a CX is ‘better’ than a trad…..

But it should be…!!!….. it’s a new ground up design using modern tech, suspension, engine, (puddle lights) etc….!!!!

I drove one when they came out, I loved it, I really seriously considered buying one…..

However…… I still enjoy the ‘conectedness’, the imperfections, the history……. the fact that it was in production decades after it should have been superseded… of a trad……😆

I don’t need a ‘daily driver’, but if at all possible I drive mine daily.

Who knows I may get a CX one day, but I think my 4/4 will be with me for some time yet….🤞🏻😆😎

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