Talk Morgan Forums Morgan Sports Cars Maintenance & Servicing 4/4 1.5l starter problem

Hello to all from an NG.
Am trying to sort a starter problem on 1964 1.5 4/4- pre kent engined beastie.
When cranking the starter over it is jamming and all you get is the "click" at the solenoid as the pinion seems to stick "in" and I have had to release it with a spanner on the spindle stub at the back of the starter. This happened before and as a new starter had been fitted by a garage, I took it back and they fitted a new one. A month or 2 down the line it has started doing this again, mainly when the battery is down a bit- can anyone help?
We are having great weather here, and I,m missing my fun!

Welcome Greenmachine, I am just wondering if you have answered the issue yourself, namely the battery being down a bit. My plan of action would be to Check the cables from the battery through to the starter motor and earth are clean. If no improvement get the battery checked out.
Good luck.

I'm somewhat of a battery expert as I have a few cars and garden machinery that lie unused for months!

Two things I'd say. Most of the time, once a battery is flat, it's as good as dead. There's little point recharging them as sooner or later it's going to let you down. Some will disagree and sometimes a new battery can be brought to life - but usually a fully depleted battery will have damaged cells and won't hold a charge.

Secondly, it sounds like you've lost the required 'woof' or Cranking Amps in your battery. So it will be enough to power lights and things, but not quite enough to turn over the engine - so the starter clicks. You can quite cheaply buy a CCA tester which will give you the available amperage.

As above, clean (rough up) the earthing just to be certain its not that - then try a jump start and you'll find that hopefully your starter is just fine.... Buy yourself a new battery.

If your starting motor stick's put the car in 2nd gear get a couple of mates to help you to shove it in backward jerks ( the car, not your mates ) This usually releases the bendix.

Hate to be the bearer of bad news, but starter pinions are usually pretty hard metal, and the flywheel ring gear is normal stuff.

There is a chance therefore that that the starter pinion is jamming on a worn ring gear.

If the battery is in good order and it's not a case of a high load draining a defective battery, remove the starter and with a torch look at the ring gear. Changing one at home is possible, but you'll need an assistant as you'll need to take the engine out, and remove the flywheel.

Tricky bit is heating all the ring and shrinking it onto the flywheel in the right place.

Hello There,
Thank you for the advice, the battery seems to run out of steam quickly it,s a 36amp hour, fairly new. As the beastie still has a generator and has only been getting short runs, having no roof and with the duff weather we have been having, maybe the battery is not getting charged up enough. The starter only seems to jam when cranking power is down.
I am going to whip the starter out later and have a look at the pinion etc. Crossing my fingers.

The Lucas starter on Woodstock, a 72 4/4 with a crossflow was a feeble device and not really capable of starting a high compression tuned engine at all.

A geared starter (mine came from Cambridge Motorsport) was a complete solution with less battery drain and a much higher cranking speed; expensive though. Good chance the pre-crossflow starter is the same fitting, and if you can get one at a sensible price, could transform the car. Mine turned the tuned engine faster than a Lucas one would turn a standard engine even with a battery so flat the ignition didn't work. I don't mind admitting that flummoxed me for a few minutes.

PS The starter 'jamming' with a low charged battery is more symptomatic of a lack of battery power - not a jam at all. The battery cradle in a 72 4/4 will take a high capacity version of the 038. Check but it may be an 018 or 016 - can't remember the number.

again thanks to all of you for the help and suggestions, I am beginning to wonder if a hotter battery or a change to an alternator might cure things long term. Does anyone know whats available in kits etc for doing the change, brackets etc wiring bits? and has anyone done said conversion?
Regards and thanks,
Charles

Hello There,
Thanks for that, battery terminals , connections are all ok, As one of the other helpful owners said maybe a bigger beefier battery is whats needed, or a change to an alternator to keep it topped up since it is only getting intermittent driving because of the weather.If the is a run of good days and have a drive it starts no problem, left a few days it takes a bit of cranking to start.
Regards,
Charles

You could always connect a battery conditioner to keep the battery topped up when not in use - assuming car is garaged and you have mains power...

Cheers,