Talk Morgan Forums Morgan Sports Cars Morgan Three Wheeler & Super 3 Steering - again

I think the 'bump steer' issue has had a fair airing on here, but having been out for a few hours today, in the sunshine, on fast but bendy two lane A and B roads, I have been trying to identify another issue related to steering feel, and am wondering if it is just mine, or does everyone's car do it.

I am referring to the fact that not only does the steering weight up appreciably as the wheel is turned more, but, more importantly, the car seems to turn in quite suddenly with a relatively small amount of wheel turning, then as the bend continues, you find the steering lock has to be eased off, just to maintain the same radius, meaning that it is very difficult to turn in and maintain lock until the apex is passed, when the lock can be unwound.

Further, when traveling on a straight but undulating or downright bumpy bit of road, with a car coming the opposite way, I do not have confidence that the my car will track straight and true, probably related to the 'bump steer' issue.

Remember, I am talking about driving at speeds here, on country roads, possibly in excess of the speed limit for the road, but as the car is taking all my concentration to control, I am unable to glance at the speedo to check.

Is this behavior normal, or is it just mine, and either way, has anyone found a cure ye?

Suggest you slow down a bit - Mogs take better to cruising!

hi paulJ - my M3W does not behave like this!

The steering does weight up a bit - but not much - and I do not have any of the problems you describe.

May I suggest that your tracking is "out" - when I had mine re-set at the factory it transformed the car!

hope this helps

Sounds like toe out .... And you need more toe in.

Toe out, if I recall correctly, gives rapid turn in but is unstable on the straight... Toe in is a more leisurely turn in but much more stable on the straight.

Not difficult to adjust for a decent garage.

We have a suspension expert in these parts who can confirm.

Toe-in gives a quicker turn-in as the outer wheel is already turning into the corner when it is loaded. Also gives better directional stability.
Toe-out deadens the turn-in, because entering a corner as the outer wheel loads up it is only coming through dead ahead as lock is applied. Also causes wander - like my mind sometimes.

NB ALWAYS set toe-angle with the car normally laden, as on the new three wheeler and the Classic 4 wheelers the toe angle changes significantly with load on the front. Regards PJB.

Thanks all, toe out did occur to me, Interestingly, the toe was set by the factory only a hundred miles or so, ago, and they assured me that it would eliminate the bump steer........hmm!

I will try a bit of toe in and see what happens. I wonder if the weighting up thing is to do with castor, which of course is set in production?

I've had different toe-ins and outs and so far the car still wanders and feels a bit nervous at some speeds, and is difficult to keep in a straight line.

But rather oddly it does sort of suit the car and perhaps isn't as bad as yours sounds.

I do know the tracking has been changed from time to time so I would speak with a few dealers to see if they have any advice, since they have been trying to different settings to get the best compromise.

Is anybody going to the factory soon? It would be a good to ask what the correct/preferrred toe in/out settings are for the differing?? suspension setups. ie early cars # 1-200 cf later cars with different steering racks and any other improvements etc etc.

Has anybody noted a tyre wear pattern on the front tyres? especially those with significant mileage.

I ahve any early car and the steering is a bit as described in this thread. Best thing i have done todate is to ensure front tyre pressures are at or just below the recommended 22psi

Recently had the uprated lower wishbones put on, alignment done at that time to the handbook figure of 4 mm toe out. Cant say that I notice any change though. If the alignment is as sensitive as tyre pressures maybe a matter of a degree might be significant??
Alignment would have been done unladen, so might go back and see if a loaded figure is any different.

A little more specific info ex factory would be reassuring especially when distance prevents going back to factory!!

Hi Paul, have you been driving my car? Your description is spot on, although I have noticed a marginal improvement when driving 2 up.

Just another point, if I get chance this weekend I'm going to whip the front shocks off and take some measurements with a view to replacing them with adjustable spring platform dampers so the ride hight can be lowered say 30mm or so, thereby lifting the steering arms by default which may alleviate the bump steer.

Funny you should mention two up, it completely changes my car and makes it a darling to drive, well in comparison to the way it is with just me aboard anyhow. Maybe I ought to go around with a couple of bags of sand in the passenger seat? Or, more to the point, set it up with the drivers weight.

I like the idea of adjustable spring platforms, to lower the front end. There seems to be plenty of ground clearance, so 30mm shouldn't be a problem, especially if it is correct that the factory actually raised the ride height, thus upsetting the whole front end! Shades of the old rubber bumper MGB! I have some Caterham spring shocker units lying around in the attic, maybe I'll have a play just in case they work.