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Joined: Oct 2011
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Talk Morgan Addict
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You are quite right of course Redneck, and it is always a matter of personal preference and what each individual owner is prepared to put up with.

Sadly, when Morgan re-designed the car, from the Pete Larsen original, for whatever reason they decided to allow a large degree of camber and toe change to be incorporated leading to bump steer and very odd steering behavior, made worse when they changed the OE Suplex shocks and springs for Spax and raised the ride height.

After over 2 years of very vociferous complaints about the dangerous way the car handled, they eventually copied a design that an owner had submitted. They may have eventually designed it this way themselves or not, but it is a sad day when an owner has to do the design work that we have all paid for when purchasing our cars.

Anyway, that is now in the past, the cynically named 'Comfort' kit, designed for the Americans, according to Morgans press release at the time, only addressed the height of the steering arms, to bring the track rod up to an acceptable level. This has vastly reduced the amount of kickback going through to the steering wheel, but has not completely removed the change in camber and or toe. It is very easy to demonstrate this by jumping up and down on the front of the car, and watching to see if the front wheels move - they should not, and do not, when the Empire kit is fitted, this in both directions i.e. toe and camber.

I have not driven a car with only the spacers, but the reports I read here indicate that it makes a huge difference. What the Empire kit does is to go one step further and completely correct the whole front end geometry, so that like practically every car on the road, unequal length wishbones are employed which means that with the revised pivot points, the top and bottom wishbones as well as the steering track rod all describe exactly the same arc of movement, and so the wheel stays exactly upright or in the position it has been set at, which is normally around 1.5 degrees of negative camber, and the toe also stays the same, no matter what the suspension is doing.

The fact that it is fully adjustable by the very simple use of two spherical joints is purely an added facility for those who want to play around with their adjustments. I have not touched mine since I got it from Empire, but I am hearing of very interesting results by going to more camber, which appears to give more front end grip - what we desperately need to reduce the understeer inherent with the basic design.

When Redneck say: "I could not see spending several thousand dollars for it vs. less than Two hundred dollars for the Comfort Kit. " I have worked out that the Empire kit, at the current rate of exchange is $1350 and I was under the impression that the "Comfort" kit is actually around £200 which equates to $340, so yes it is $1000 dollars more, but bear in mind that the Empire kit incorporates the spacer or riser that Morgan sell, although a slightly different and more elegant design, but also throw in a completely new set of wishbones, spherical joints billet ali. bracket and of course all the nuts, bolts and washers needed to fit it. These prices are all a little misleading of course, because post and packing and fitting all have to be added, but then again, many people with the kit have fitted it themselves.

For those who have the Morgan "Comfort" kit, but want the advantage of the fully adjustable upper wishbones, I understand that Bill at Empire is prepared to sell these separately, but I haven't a clue what sort of price he would charge, obviously substantially less than the full kit though.

It is gratifying for me, to know that everyone who has fitted the kit so far has been blown away with what it has done to improve the car, I was a bit reticent to be too enthusiastic in case my feeling was not echoed by others, and they would be disappointed, but this has not been the case.

On another topic, those that have opted for buy the new upgraded adjustable Suplex damper kit, have found that, because of the longer springs there has been contact with the exhaust on some cars, and this seems to be worse with the Empire kit fitted, but having spoken to Bill, he nor I, can understand why this should be as the height of the car is purely determined by the springs and shock absorbers, not the type of wishbone fitted. It is also interesting to note, that, to my knowledge, Bill has not been approached by either Morgan or Suplex for any reason, yet they are both working on a fix so that Suplex can be run in conjunction with the Empire kit. In my naivity, I might have thought at least a 'phone chat might be useful!

I believe that Bill is soon to be adding some Morgan stuff to his website at www.empireracingcars.com


Paul
[At last, I have a car I can polish]
Joined: Mar 2013
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Has a lot to Say!
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Has a lot to Say!
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Nice, comprehensive update Paul. And just to add that my car has ALWAYS had a shock-to-header distance issue (but only one one side if you please), which was highlighted initially when fitting my Spax Adjustables, as the spring is longer and brings the bottom coils and adjuster into close proximity to the header.

Fitting my Empire Kit has not changed this whatsoever, ie: it is NOT the cause in my case at least. The 'fix' is to crank up the ride height just a touch, until clearance looks reasonable again. For what it's worth, I am now back to the 15cm height from very front of the 'tub' (measured each side from behind the wheel, under the rear wishbone mounts) to the ground. I tried it as low as 13.5cm at one point, but that was never going to give a workable clearance, so I am back up to stock ride-height I suspect. No discernible difference to me in handling over that 15mm or so change.

For me however, it's not just the lack of bumpsteer I notice, but the vast improvement in steering 'clarity' and delicacy that makes the Empire Kit stand out.

Joined: May 2012
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Talk Morgan Enthusiast
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Joined: May 2012
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It took a lot for me to stump up the £800 for the Empire kit but I'm glad I did. The steering feel and my confidence in the steering is now light years away from where it was when I got the car.
It can now be driven without the thought it was going to kill me at any and every opportunity.
I cannot thank Paul and Bill enough for helping me turn my car into what it should have been in the first place.

Joined: Oct 2012
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Talk Morgan Sage
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Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 6,538
good feedback from all ...very many thanks..and thank goodness Bill got involved..so that for those who want/need it there is a perfect fix:))

Might ask Bill about the Morgan fix + his kit Cost.


Neil

Joined: Jun 2012
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Talk Morgan Expert
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+1 with all that Dab of oppo. My car with the Empire kit is now predictable cornering and requires no mid corner corrections. As you say, how it should have been in the first place.


Joined: Nov 2013
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Talk Morgan Regular
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Joined: Nov 2013
Posts: 582
As a Yank with a fixation on Brit Bikes I can remember great sadness when the guys in the British motorcycle industry stood around going "ummm" while the Japanese said lets make motorcycles. Hopefully, and obviously someone is "umming" a lot about making MY Morgan 3W handle from the factory. It really scared me(this is an understatement) until I installed the Empire Kit. I remember telling PaulJ what a great joy my first drive was and that he must have been able to hear my rebel yell Yahooo! all the way to the UK. Further more while I'm on my soapbox I wonder, just wonder if all the dire news I hear about cracked frames might be lessened due to the improved smoothness in the front suspension?

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