Talk Morgan Forums Morgan Sports Cars Classic Morgans (pre-CX) 4/4 versus +4

Have to agree, a few changes and the Sport becomes a better Mog the ECU remap gives you more torque and BHP add intake mods and exhaust for a little bit more.

The other week I had the pleasure of driving IcePacks 4/4 Sport with the 4:10 diff.
IcePack's Morgan only has the diff change and is in all respects a standard engine and exhaust.. He also has AVO's and brake reaction bars.

Basically we were neck and neck, until 4:10 early gear changes where I could creeped ahead.
In Standard form 4:10 geared mog felt flat and had no torque and would defiantly benefit from an ECU upgrade but I did not like the high rpm's with the gearbox ratio's
I would say the Diff noisy from the ring and pinion spoilt the drive a is common fault with 4:10 gearing. This conversion is not a cheap upgrade and is more suited to a track day Mog not a road Mog or touring Mog there are other options.

Maybe the Throttle bodies or a larger Throttle body and or engine tuning are the way to go with a torque bias rather than full BHP as most 4/4 Sports will use on the road.

But the true difference was not the Morgans speeds, but the handling characteristics.

Twisties are where the fun lies in the 4/4 Sport, so suspension set up is the best upgrade you can do IMO with a small amount of tuning.

Panhard rod
Traction bars
Brake reaction bars
AVO shocks
Negative camber plates
Front springs (but not Suplex as they are a comfort upgrade not a performance upgrade IMO)
Move the track rod ends to the top of the stub axle.

I have agonised over my Sport and in the past coveted engine upgrade's from 3.0l V6 to a 4 cylinder 2.5l to get more. I also Have a tuned 3.5 V8 lump with Gas flowed heads that would just slide in.... well + a gear box.
I could but then I go for a drive and all is well in 4/4 Sport land that is until my overactive brain goes back to the start... more power..... Big is better.. But in all truth maybe it's not as I alway come back to my 4/4 Sport as she's a babe!


Cain

That's what eventually persuade me to chop in my competition spec 4/4 for my 3.0 Roadster Cain. More power! And I now regret it....as you say, the 4/4 is great on the twisties, the Roadster far less so.

I agree pretty much completely, and over the last 15 years I've been evolving my 4/4 to be as you describe, the only differences being:

1. The Ecotec Z18XER conversion gives c. 170bhp, which is just right in my view - a bit more than a stock 4/4 Sport.
2. I haven't needed to change the track rod location as I have a steering box, not R&P
3. I haven't fitted negative camber plates yet, I've not noticed any issues with turn-in agility
4. My car is so old it had the old Girling single-piston brake callipers, so these were replaced with twin piston HiSpec jobs from Peter Mulberry.
5. Although I agree the Suplex conversion is more about comfort than performance, I find the additional compliance is very welcome on poor quality roads.
6. My original 4.11:1 diff wore out its crosstree, and rather than having it rebushed I got Billy Bellinger to put in a Quaife ATB. I love it.
7. One point about AVO shocks - despite them being offered in 3 different lengths/movement ranges, I ended up having to get them to make me a custom set for my car to ensure they didn't bottom or top-out at each extent. Fortunately they were able to do this at no extra charge, and it only took them a couple of weeks to do.

The result is a car that goes extremely well, and outperforms my ability or self-preservation instinct - as comprehensively demonstrated a couple of years back by Spanner Juggler, who left me trailing in his wake on the A835

Sorry I dont get it the plus four is a great car easily as chuckable as a four four it felt more planted on the road and only a few inches wider,the Duratec is a joy and you can really wind it up as on the four four.I love the idea of throttle bodies but they only come into their own on the upper rev range.The plus four does everything asked of it and i will surely buy another when its time to change but would like a sports exhaust just for the noise,the economy on the four four is billiant but personally i would trade that off for the extra Bhp on the plus four.We did 20k in ours with an average of 36 mpg you cant really ask for more out of a 2 litre car and ultra reliable.(did I mention water leaks )

I love the sound of your engine conversion 170BHP sounds good There I go again time to think about engine changes!

My reason for the neg plates on my 2009 4/4 Sport was to overcome my Mogs Understeer issues. But I would say everything is all about give and take and some alterations are not for every one.

It was by driving Icepacks 4/4 Sport Morgan I truly found out how far I had developed my Mog into something special, and would not be everyones cup of tea.

Cain

This thread is great. Keep it coming..

I have had both the +4 makes a more relaxing drive & the wider body helps as well.

Now moved up to a Roadster which has more of everything . Grin grin

I have fitted the full Aero Throttle Body kit, Manifold , cat and exhaust- backed up by an Omex map and get 163 BHP to my 4/4 ( with spare and rack)-.bags of fun.

Additionally, I've added negative camber plates, Panhard rod, Gaz Adjustables,the 4:1 diff and the Avons.

Is it a " relaxing" car to drive? - no. Despite the ( modest) improvements in the torque curve as others have said - it's in the + 4000 rpm range that the grin factor fully kicks in

Do I drive a 4/4 to relax? - no. I love the road holding and just how lively it is. Just about any other car I drive is a better cruiser - I went for the 4/4 because I had driven a full Competition version- and absolutely fell in love with it despite the fact that it was more expensive than a standard + 4.

Each to their own- but right now this Morgan is exactly what I need to " live a little"

JB62.All the work you had done makes it all sound a bit frantic I like it....

Em

4/4 sport powerfull is a 4/4 75 th anniversary
I try one 4/4 sport And No problem the 2 liters in the 4/4 body with Mazda gearbox it is perfect