Talk Morgan Forums Morgan Sports Cars Maintenance & Servicing tire wear patern, camber and toe-out

I noticed after 14000km considerable un-even wear on the front tires. The insides are wearing more. Dont know if that is normal, so i measured camber and toe-in. I found, negative camber, 1.8 deg right and 1.25 degrees left side. Toe-in turned out to be toe-out by 0.4 deg. Some questions? Is neg camber normal on a standard 2010 roadster? Is de inside tire wear normal or could it be a result of the toe-out and camber?
Cheers J

Toe out will scrub a bit off the insides, as will
too much negative camber.

Hi JJL
Camber I have never measured on my 2008 4/4
Toe in was though as the Stainless pins were replaced with Chromed soon after I acquired the machine.
I measured with a home made jig at the wheel rims and settled at 1.5mm toe-in. Tyre wear is negligible now.

You don't mention the model and age of your car.

In my opinion, anything over .75 degree for road use on a Morgan is unnecessary and anywhere between 0 and .50 deg probably best. Negative camber will cause the car to try and follow any tramlines and other road surface imperfections.

As for toe-out of .04 deg, I know of no conditions when any car is set up with toe-out. I can't remember the setting for a Plus Eight and in any event it will be in imperial!

The uneven wear is probably caused by both the extreme negative camber and toe-out.

I suspect that your car's handling will be interesting to say the least.

Hi David, The car is a 2010 roadster. I bought it new and camber was never changed as far as i know. How did I end up with these values? Ex works? Toe-was probably "changed" when dealer alinged the position of the steering wheel, it was off centre when driving straight. The car handles not too strangely, not much different from my previous plus4. Or i got used to it. I'll get my measurements checked by a workshop and correct toe-in. Might have a new morgan expererience ;-)
Will a modern tire shop be able to do the checks? Or is it Morgan specialist stuff
cheers Jjw

Hi JJW,

Have a quick look under your car and determine whether your car has adjustable camber plates. They are fitted at the bottom of the kingpin and will be close to the bottom of the wheel. Non-adjustable have two vertical bolts and a nut that screws the bottom of the kingpin to the camber plate. The adjustable one has been fitted by the factory for a few years now and has a horizontal threaded stud that allows the camber to be adjusted. I wonder whether this has been messed with by someone without understanding the consequences.

To adjust, one needs a camber gauge or even just a dead straight piece of wood and an accurate spirit level gauge.

It is strange that the garage messed with the steering to re-align the steering wheel.

I cheched, non adjustable. CheersJ

Hi JJW,

If they are non-adjustable, then you may have a more serious problem. The negative camber should not be so extreme on a non-adjustable car.

Has the front of the car been mis-treated: accident, mild accident, hit a kerb? Is everything securely fixed: camber plates, kingpin bottom stays, anti-tramp bars?
Does everything look straight: cross-frame top tube and bottom tube?

Check that one or both of the cross-frame tension bars are not broken or loose as these bars prevent the cross-frame from bending.

The easy way to visually check is to remove the front wheels and shine a torch through the tube to see if a bend is visible; if it is bent, it will be obvious. The top tubes are clear; unfortunately the bottom tubes are obscured by the kingpins so a cursory check is only possible.

If the tubes are bent slightly, they are easily straightened without heat. Simply use a long bar inserted into the cross-frame and carefully ease the bend straight. Remember that a Morgan was designed in the blacksmith era!

Finally JJW, I do not intend alarming you but wish to make you aware of as many of the possible causes. One last thought, make sure that you have measured your camber correctly as if you have made an error, this would be the best solution and make all my suggestions invalid and also not cost you a penny!

Thanks David very valuable advice. I am the only driver, nothing happened to the car afaik. I did visually check for obvious signs, but nothing apparant. My measurements were done, car on garage floor, with a piece of alloy box section on the rim edges a spirit level and a calliper. Repeated with the wheels turned 180deg The negative camber is also visible with the naked eye. In any case i'll get it checked by a garage an check the front end when it is off the floor.
Cheers J

You're welcome. And don't be too alarmed; I'm sure that the issue will be simple to resolve.

Your approach to the measurement is sound.

Regarding the cross-frame tension bars, try tapping them with a spanner or similar metal object. The should 'ring' and be similar in sound pitch; a dull sound will indicate the one or both is loose. I think you will understand what I mean.

A tyre fitting garage should have the measuring equipment necessary. The toe-out is not a particular concern unless it is associated with the extreme negative camber. I will try and take some photos of my car with the camber measurement in place if this will help you.

I would recommend somewhere around 0 to .25 deg negative best for road use.