Talk Morgan Forums Morgan Sports Cars Maintenance & Servicing Morgan Plus 4 - Drive train noise

Jay: Thank you for your comments. I have enjoyed owning a number of BMW motorcycles over the years as well and each engine had similar yet very different characteristics - R100RS, R1200C, R1100s Boxercup and R1200GS Adventure - and the favourite? The R100RS - still the best bike that I ever owned. Now if only I could find another.....in Blue and Smoke Grey....I'd be a happy man!

Please note the noise in my Morgan is with the clutch engaged i.e. pedal out - though the more I hear from the good folk on this forum the less concerned I become about the noise. Still, I will take this as far as I can and compare notes with others when the opportunity to put a few cars together in one place arises to see how each one compares to the other.

Meanwhile, I shall wait to hear from my dealer on the question of what oil was put into the gearbox last April and what additive he is proposing to add - and why.

Update on progress.

As mentioned in an earlier post, I highlighted to the dealer that they had changed the gearbox oil during a service in April 15 and I asked them to clarify what oil they had used (the invoice doesn't specify this). Here is the response:

"The gradient used in the gearboxes is 75/90 the same used for in the Ford/Mazda boxes. The additive I’m unsure of at the minute but as soon as the parts guy has returned from his hospital appointment I will get the required information."

As I have no idea whether or not 75/90 oil is better or worse than the recommended 75/80 oil I emailed them a couple of days ago asking if they were content that the oil met the specification recommended in my handbook (ESD-M2C186-A 75w80). I am now waiting for a response to that question plus the information on the proposed additive.

As an aside, the service in April 15 invoiced the then owner for 5 litres of gearbox oil, though according to the car's handbook the gearbox oil capacity is 1.5 litres. As a newbie this is all very confusing!

Update:

Dealer has confirmed that the gearbox was filled with Mobilube 1 SHC 75w90 during the service in April 2015 (as this is - apparently - an approved alternative).

Still no information on the additive the dealer has proposed, though I am being asked if I would like it added. Clearly I am reluctant to say yes or no without more detailed information on the product itself. The dealer is however saying that 'a lot of Morgan owners use the additive' so could I ask the forum if they have any experience of using an additive of this type?

My own 'internet' investigations show that Ford recommends that MT75 Gearboxes from 2000 on should use oil spec WSD-M2C200-C rather than the ESD-M2C186-A listed in the Morgan handbook. Assuming this to be the case I have now compared the Ford Motocraft WSD-M2C200-C spec with the Mobilube 1 SHC, please see below:

Mobilube 1 SHC Ford Motocraft

Grade: 75w-90 v 75w-90

40c 102 v 76
100c 15.1 v 15.4
Vis Index 156 v 211
Density 0.87 v 0.87

Both are fully synthetic oils. I am now having difficulty interpreting the spec sheet information. Should I be concerned about the differences in the @40C and Viscosity Index figures? And would using the Ford oil make a difference in both the short and long terms?

Any advice on this matter, based on your own knowledge and/or experience, will be most welcome.

I found this Ford doc which ties up with your findings on the use of a 75W-90 oil. http://www.ctm.it/pdf/Powertrain%20Product%20Guide%202007.pdf
Perhaps you found the same doc?
I tried to attach the doc directly but could not manage it.
Cheers
John

I'm not a fan of gearbox additives, and would only consider using additive as a last resort.

John:
Thank you very much for the link - I had not seen that document. I found some useful information at this link:

Talk Morgan

It appears that post 2000 MT75 gearboxes should use the newer spec oil WSD M2C200-C.

Dave W:
I am of the same opinion regarding additives. What is annoying is that the dealer has gone from advising adding the additive to now saying that a lot of Morgan owners use this additive (still not defined by name)and they would be happy to put some in if I want. Key phrase being 'if I want'. Ball and responsibility somehow back in my side of the court!

I can't help but feel that following the manufacturer's recommendation is the place to start....rather than the dealer's 'claimed equivalent' spec.....Mobilube 1 SHC

My research suggests that the MT75 gearboxes are sensitive to the oil used and I would have thought that putting in the WSD M2C200-C was the best course of action and then seeing if that made a difference.

I never thought that this would turn out to be so complicated!

My 4/4 4 seater (2004) has the same feature (noise). I assumed it is the bearings on the lay shaft. I have used Ford F1045737 oil at around £48 for 2 litres. About 1.7 litres used in the oil change. Very smelly, smell sticks on the hands for ages.

While more noisy than the R380 box on my +8, the gear change on the MT75 seems to be much lighter, but not as good as on my Mazda 6

Mike Smith

teknome: Many thanks for your comments - much appreciated. The Ford Gear Oil you have used (F1045737) (as far as I have been able to glean from t'internet) is indeed the one recommended for post-2000 MT75 gearboxes (Oil spec: WSD M2C200-C).

Shifting on my box seems to be okay but it is really hard to determine differences in shifting and noise without having two gearboxes/cars to compare, and even then there may be other factors at play (e.g. mileage) that are likely to influence the outcome. But see below:

I'm pleased to say that my car went off to the dealer today for further investigation of this issue. I am also pleased to say that the dealer has a car with the same engine and gearbox in stock and should therefore be able to do a direct comparison between the two (well, as direct as is possible given the many variations in play).

I will update you and everyone else on the outcome as and when.

Update (and hopefully closure of the topic!):

The car has been inspected by the dealer and no mechanical issues have been found. The gearbox oil has been changed for the Ford recommended WSD M2C200-c spec. There does not appear to be any noticeable change in drive train noise (to date) but I am happier knowing that there are no mechanical issues and that the recommended oil is now in the box.

Just need some good weather now to take it for a spin

My thanks to you all for your advice and help - it has been an education!