Talk Morgan Forums Community The Malvern Arms EU Referendum quiz; find out how much you know

Dear Mogless in Paris,

Probably too late but I see that some expats are going to court to try to get the right to vote in the referendum. I have never voted in the UK but I am a British citizen and like many others I rely on being a citizen of an EU country for many aspects of life in the EU. For example without that I would have to have permit just to live and/or work in Italy

I have no idea how all this will work out if the UK leaves the European Community. I and many, many others may have a bureaucratic nightmare ahead of us. In the end it may be easier to adopt the citizenship of an EU country.

I'm pretty pessimistic about this and I think that the vote to leave will win. It won't gain a dam thing for the UK, except perhaps the loss of Scotland, but it will be a loss to Europe,not a grave loss, but a loss. Perhaps in the end that will be better than the half in half out status at the moment but it will take a while to re-establish the equilibrium and sort out the mess left behind.

How very true!

One of my mates in the pub last night held a quick straw poll - they are typical working class labour voters lets say, and they were all voting leave.

I was suprised at that, and it may not bode well for the stay vote if their attitude is widespread across the silent majority of ordinary people who just feel they have had enough.

The trouble is that we have all had enough. It's just that we don't know exactly what it is that we have had enough of, and who to blame for it.

Popularist parties will always trade on this and choose to blame, migrants, the euro, whoever is in government at the moment, etc. Half the time they don't really believe half of what they say themselves but they know what is popular, will get people stirred up, and likely to win them power.

Good luck guys. We're all going to need it.

http://elloydowen.com/2016/06/02/the-eu-referendum-why-i-am-no-longer-a-fence-sitter/

What about this for a theory then?

It's an interesting analysis, and I think he's right that the government secretly thinks we should leave (otherwise why did they rig the vote by denying British ex-pats the chance to vote) but I think it comes to the wrong conclusions - especially when it boils down to 'politicians think it's a good idea, so it must be'.

Exactly. The EU has long been the whipping boy of the UK press, so it's hardly surprising that it has become a proxy for the population's various frustrations, whatever they happen to be.

Politicians like to blame somebody else. The Westminster club blame Europe. Sturgeon blames Westminster.

But remove the bogeymen and you're accountable. 'Up North' we have ghettos of non-english speaking economic migrants who by the very fact of not speaking the language are reliant on benefits, and need housing, education for their kids and access to healthcare. Two examples of this are a Roma group in Rotherham and a Somali group in Sheffield. They don't integrate, and there are tensions not only with 'the english', but also with Asian groups and to a lesser extent the Afro-Caribbeans in Sheffield. The extreme right wing parties are taking advantage of this situation in the affected areas.
From interviews on local TV it's quite obvious that the long wait for doctors appointments and difficulty getting hospital beds is being blamed on immigrants. There's a huge groundswell of leave voters in the North.

It will be very interesting to see a map of how the country has voted. The problem that Labour has is that the party line of Remain is at odds with working class Labour supporters and that may have further ramifications come the next general election.

Having said all that I still think it will be a close vote.

Try telling that to the latte drinking, metropolitan liberal elite in Barnsley - and they won't believe you!

I think it will be like the Scottish vote, ideology and desires is one thing but when push comes to shove and you have to vote for something you know nothing of what the outcome will look like you're very brave. I suspect that then the status-quo will remain.