Talk Morgan Forums Community The Malvern Arms Bye Bye Boris

Well that is easy to answer. All the political leaders in the rest of the EU want a decisive leader in the UK and they want the UK out now.

They really don't like the idea of a United Kingdom that wants the benefits but is not part of the EU. The half-in half-out situation that has existed up till now is barely acceptable and they are not inclined to support a quarter-in three-quarters-out arrangement. This will mean very difficult negotiations for the UK and no concessions if the UK wants to re-join in a few years time.

Why should they take such a hard line? Simple: they don't want any other countries to consider exiting the EU. Such a break up of the EU would lead to a disaster in economic relationships and trade for the smaller economies within the current EU structure and would not be all that good for the larger economies either.

The Euro is an intrinsic part of the Union and it is obligatory, in a very weak way, that member states join the Euro. Denmark and the United Kingdom are the two "opt-out" exceptions. In my opinion the adoption of the Euro should be a condition of joining and until a state is able to join the Euro Zone they should be limited to a trade agreement.

This is a bit of drift on the thread but relates to why nobody actually wants to be responsible for taking the UK out of the EU.

Without a doubt some reform of the EU is required but that is another topic.

I think it's rather more complicated than that. This excerpt from a piece by Timothy Garton Ash in the Grauniad explains it quite well IMHO. (I must say, I do like his potential new name for our country after the Scots leave; FUK - Former UK).


Broadly speaking, there are two positions among our European partners. A minority position, articulated by commission president Jean-Claude Juncker, French president François Hollande and Belgian prime minister Charles Michel, says, in effect, “Goodbye and good riddance. The British people have spoken. The UK should leave as soon as possible and let us move ahead to build Europe around its original Carolingian core.” In Michel’s own words: “Only the Belgian and European interests count for me now – not the British ones. There is no way back.”

At a meeting of the European Council on Foreign Relations in The Hague, I experienced at first hand the anger this neo-Carolingian gambit provoked from many other member states, including most eastern and northern European ones. The former Finnish prime minister Alexander Stubb fiercely criticised a meeting of the six founding member states, hastily called as a response to the Brexit vote. Estonia’s gloriously outspoken president Toomas Ilves calls Juncker’s behaviour “abominable”. Finland and Estonia belong to the majority of EU member states, led by Angela Merkel, who want to give Britain some time to try to sort this out.

Broadly speaking, they believe that the strategic objective must be to keep as much as possible of the United Kingdom – or will it be the Former United Kingdom (FUK), like the Former Yugoslavia? – as closely associated as possible with the European Union. This is not only because they value what Britain has to offer, from free-market economics to foreign and security policy, but also because they fear the domino effect of a British withdrawal. At the same time, and precisely to avoid that domino effect, they insist that Britain cannot be offered any special favours in the negotiations, for that would encourage Frexiteers such as Marine Le Pen and Nexiteers such as Geert Wilders to try their luck. So: no access to the single market without free movement of people.

Yet their anger is also directed at Britain and, more specifically, at England. The most devastating comment comes from the Dutch prime minister, Mark Rutte, a great Anglophile and erstwhile ally of David Cameron. “England,” he says, “has collapsed politically, monetarily, constitutionally and economically.” Ouch. The reproach of disappointed friends is more painful than the schadenfreude of gloating Belgians.

I got to say real UK politics is much more interesting than fictional. This plot of the Gove character and his cunning wife would never be believable in any "Yes, Minister" series.

But in all honesty what I really can't grasp is just how can he - apparently the political equivalent of a weasel - still be considered as a candidate for the Party leadership and consequently for Prime Minister of the United Kingdom.

Oh and this ... this is priceless:

https://twitter.com/davidschneider/status/748190032129826817

Wonder if Brexit will influence the rerun of the Austrian election following a court ruling?

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/07/...after-far-righ/

He may look like Harry Potter, but he is actually Voldemort.

Mr.Hofer, our far rigth wing runner for president will see no problems. The demagogues always know the very best simple solutions - and often enough dumb people are voting for them....

I hope the Austrian people will repeat their vote for Van der Bellen, hopefully with an even better ratio than last time!

Does anyone remember the first series of "House of Card".

You might think that, I couldn't possibly comment.

Have a good weekend out there in the EU TM'ers.

One thing for sure Boris won't be on our minds - fun will be ..

That was a very realistic portrayl of politics UK style , nasty !

And it seems they are back for real!