Click here to return to the home page.
Image of a road.
Who's Online Now
1 members (CooperMan), 247 guests, and 31 robots.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Top Posters(30 Days)
John V6 78
+8Rich 71
DaveW 67
Luddite 57
Newest Members
Ulfulf, Wilfried, Classic-Line, BrunswickGreen44, Franco Morgan
9,203 Registered Users
Newest Topics
Technical drawings, dimensions, 3D model M3W
by Oskar - 20/07/25 04:13 PM
Goggle eyed
by Roady - 19/07/25 06:16 PM
FOR SALE AERO8 series 1 WHEELS
by t50 - 19/07/25 12:07 PM
Lions Tour
by OZ 4/4 - 19/07/25 11:55 AM
Morgan rebuild on Facebook
by TBM - 19/07/25 10:50 AM
Ride Comfort & Tyre Age – Plus 4 Duratec
by Nick B - 19/07/25 10:22 AM
Super3 Accessory Rails for Side Blades
by BillHart - 18/07/25 11:59 PM
Latest Photos
Motorworld München
Motorworld München
by Oskar, July 20
visit to Classic Remise Düsseldorf
my book
my book
by Oskar, July 20
More Pictures of the MHR Visit
More Pictures of the MHR Visit
by DaveK, July 19
Visit to the Factory- Historic Morgan Group
Forum Statistics
Forums34
Topics48,335
Posts812,897
Members9,203
Most Online1,046
Aug 24th, 2023
Today's Birthdays
kamo30
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Page 12 of 13 1 2 10 11 12 13
Joined: Apr 2012
Posts: 5,013
Likes: 32
Charter Member
Offline
Charter Member
Joined: Apr 2012
Posts: 5,013
Likes: 32
I've followed the thread and the result looks 100%.

I didn't spot why you needed to replace the wings in the first place and who made the fibreglass wings for you and how they did that (from what mould)?


+8 4.8
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 2,403
C
Talk Morgan Expert
Offline
Talk Morgan Expert
C
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 2,403
Sid Watson makes the wings - he uses moulds he purchased from David Rutherford when he packed up.

http://www.fibreglass-mouldings-cambs.co.uk/

He actually has the mouldings for a little known 4/4 competition model the 4/4 Rutherford lightweight. It uses a complete fibreglass moulding for the entire car body and replaces all the body and wooden frame - sitting directly on the chassis. There are a few knocking about and tip the scales at about 550kg.




Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 11,854
Likes: 137
Hamwich Offline OP
Scruffy Oik
Member of the Inner Circle
OP Offline
Scruffy Oik
Member of the Inner Circle
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 11,854
Likes: 137
Originally Posted By Neilda
I didn't spot why you needed to replace the wings in the first place


The original steel wings were pretty rusty. They were made of 5 individual sections welded together, and to get a smooth surface for painting they were covered in a thin skim of filler. Over the years as the car flexes the filler cracks and water gets in, hence the rust.

I wanted to fix the car myself rather than farm out the work, and the prospect of reconstructing the wings with my poor welding skills was unattractive. Replacing the wings seemed the best option. I didn't want to fit steel wings, the modern superform wings won't fit the older cars without modification, and the cost of getting Steve Barnes to make me a set in alloy was prohibitive. Thus I decided to go with the fibreglass option.

Sid Watson and his son Matthew are a lovely couple of chaps, very enthusiastic and helpful. It was a real pleasure to get them to make my wings, and an excellent job they made of it too.


Tim H.
1986 4/4 VVTi Sport, 2002 LR Defender, 2022 Mini Cooper SE
Joined: Apr 2012
Posts: 5,013
Likes: 32
Charter Member
Offline
Charter Member
Joined: Apr 2012
Posts: 5,013
Likes: 32
Thanks Tim... I think it's a job most of us wouldn't have the plums to begin! It looks a super job and I like the idea of the colour going all the way through the material - no more stone chips showing up!

How did they mould the wings?


+8 4.8
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 11,854
Likes: 137
Hamwich Offline OP
Scruffy Oik
Member of the Inner Circle
OP Offline
Scruffy Oik
Member of the Inner Circle
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 11,854
Likes: 137
Originally Posted By Neilda
How did they mould the wings?


They have a set of moulds, originally made by Dave Rutherford. Basically it's a wooden box containing an inverse wing (ie with the smooth shiny bit on the inside). There's one mould for each wing on a car (ie 4 moulds) and there are 2 sets of moulds, one for the narrow-bodies cars, and one for the wider Plus 8s and later Plus 4s

To make the wings, firstly you clean up the surface of the mould and then coat it with a release compound that ensures the new wing won't stick to the mould.

Then you apply two layers of neat resin (a two-part epoxy), which provides the smooth outer layer - the so-called 'gel coat'. When you mix up the resin, you can add the appropriate dyes to get the final colour you want.

Pieces of woven glass fibre matting are next applied, with the pieces criss-crossing each other to provide a matrix of fibres for strength. The matting is bedded in with more resin, and you keep going until the required thickness is obtained - thin for the race cars to save as much weight as possible, thick (about 6mm) for road cars.
Once you're done, the mould is left for a few days for the new wing to cure properly and reach full strength before removing it.

Then it's simply a question of trimming the edges of the new wings to match the car onto which they are to be installed, bolting them into position and you're done!
I'm sure an experienced Morgan body expert could do it relatively quickly, I reckon I must have spent about 10 hours on each front wing and about 5 hours on each rear.


Tim H.
1986 4/4 VVTi Sport, 2002 LR Defender, 2022 Mini Cooper SE
Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 1,943
B
Talk Morgan Enthusiast
Offline
Talk Morgan Enthusiast
B
Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 1,943
When I built My +8 Bitsa I needed rear wings. Lorne Goldman sent Me His old front wings. I was able to get one rear wing from a Local Friend (new) for $50, but that left Me with one to get. I had a +4 rear wing that I added metal to but that was a bodge. Cuthbert Twillie lent Me Molds for +4 rear wings. It looked like I would be able to modify these molds for a +8. It never got done as I felt the cost/time/uncertainty was too much. So I bought a rear wing from Uncle Mel. Rutter's price was not too prohibitive but the cost of air freight to Seattle was huge. It made Me wish I had spent more time on Glas Rear Wings.


Button
Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 1,943
B
Talk Morgan Enthusiast
Offline
Talk Morgan Enthusiast
B
Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 1,943
Originally Posted By Button
When I built My +8 Bitsa I needed rear wings. Lorne Goldman sent Me His old front wings. I was able to get one rear wing from a Local Friend (new) for $50, but that left Me with one to get. I had a +4 rear wing that I added metal to but that was a bodge. Cuthbert Twillie lent Me Molds for +4 rear wings. It looked like I would be able to modify these molds for a +8. It never got done as I felt the cost/time/uncertainty was too much. So I bought a rear wing from Uncle Mel. Rutter's price was not too prohibitive but the cost of air freight to Seattle was huge. It made Me wish I had spent more time on Glas Rear Wings.


Just because I have the rear wing molds that Cuthbert Twillie made I got them out as well as a couple of spare (well used) steel ones. It became obvious that much care and craftsmanship must go into these molds if You are going to get the results that Tim got. Not to fault Cuthbert, His project did not require replacing the wings. His project was a bit different. But to get the results that Tim got required molds that were very accurate and rigid. The rear wings are a bit floppy. But magnify the front wings by about a factor of 10, It looks to Me that the wing that was used to make the mold had to be perfect. and then support welded inside the wing to keep it rigid while the mold was made. I have no idea how much Tim paid for those wings. But I bet they were worth every penny (shilling).


Button
Joined: Apr 2012
Posts: 5,013
Likes: 32
Charter Member
Offline
Charter Member
Joined: Apr 2012
Posts: 5,013
Likes: 32
Thanks Tim for such detailed replies.... really interesting. Great project and super result.


+8 4.8
Joined: Jul 2014
Posts: 1,745
Likes: 12
Talk Morgan Enthusiast
Offline
Talk Morgan Enthusiast
Joined: Jul 2014
Posts: 1,745
Likes: 12
Originally Posted By Hamwich
Originally Posted By Neilda
How did they mould the wings?


They have a set of moulds, originally made by Dave Rutherford. Basically it's a wooden box containing an inverse wing (ie with the smooth shiny bit on the inside). There's one mould for each wing on a car (ie 4 moulds) and there are 2 sets of moulds, one for the narrow-bodies cars, and one for the wider Plus 8s and later Plus 4s

To make the wings, firstly you clean up the surface of the mould and then coat it with a release compound that ensures the new wing won't stick to the mould.

Then you apply two layers of neat resin (a two-part epoxy), which provides the smooth outer layer - the so-called 'gel coat'. When you mix up the resin, you can add the appropriate dyes to get the final colour you want.

Pieces of woven glass fibre matting are next applied, with the pieces criss-crossing each other to provide a matrix of fibres for strength. The matting is bedded in with more resin, and you keep going until the required thickness is obtained - thin for the race cars to save as much weight as possible, thick (about 6mm) for road cars.
Once you're done, the mould is left for a few days for the new wing to cure properly and reach full strength before removing it.

Then it's simply a question of trimming the edges of the new wings to match the car onto which they are to be installed, bolting them into position and you're done!
I'm sure an experienced Morgan body expert could do it relatively quickly, I reckon I must have spent about 10 hours on each front wing and about 5 hours on each rear.


- how many test attempts did they have to get the colour of the gel coat right Tim?

I can imagine that ,by the time you allow for the heat as the GF sets and numerous other variables, getting the colour 'spot on' must be a truly 'black art'....

James


Aero8 , Series 1 - Boston Green
Mercedes EQC 400 AMG
Smart Brabus Convertible
Honda Monkey Z125
Joined: Apr 2014
Posts: 5,181
Likes: 2
Ray Offline
Charter Member
Offline
Charter Member
Joined: Apr 2014
Posts: 5,181
Likes: 2
Originally Posted By cerealsurfer
Sid Watson makes the wings - he uses moulds he purchased from David Rutherford when he packed up.

http://www.fibreglass-mouldings-cambs.co.uk/

He actually has the mouldings for a little known 4/4 competition model the 4/4 Rutherford lightweight. It uses a complete fibreglass moulding for the entire car body and replaces all the body and wooden frame - sitting directly on the chassis. There are a few knocking about and tip the scales at about 550kg.
Many years ago i bought one of his lightweights, it even had a light thin gauge chassie. It was a work of art. Tried to use it for autocross racing but the short suspension travel proved unsuitable on grass. Sold it to Allan kennedy who used it for a time as a circuit racer.


.+8 Now gone for a 1800 4/4. Duratec in bright yellow.
Page 12 of 13 1 2 10 11 12 13

Moderated by  TalkMorgan 

Link Copied to Clipboard
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.5