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Aug 24th, 2023
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Joined: Oct 2019
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Charter Member
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Charter Member
Joined: Oct 2019
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...the above is sobering viewing... transport uses nearly 3x the currently available energy from electricity... Even accounting for higher efficiency from EVs there's a massive shortfall in generating capacity..... ...Numbers don't add up.... ... Great graphs, and the numbers add up fine  as there isn't going to be some overnight switch to electric... although I think the new car sales transition to EV is going to be a lot faster than the car industry thought (just judging by aquaintances' interest in EV for new car purchases or leases). BUT new cars use a small proportion of the overall transport energy budget (vs lorries, buses, everyone's existing cars etc etc). Folks with on-street parking are not going to be transitioning to EV so much. And the overall desire to phase out gas CH is going to be a much bigger issue than transport... PS: I wonder if the gas network will end up transitioning to biogas or even hyrdrogen? Is the latter even feasible? https://www.energy.gov/eere/fuelcells/hydrogen-pipelines ![[Linked Image]](https://www.tm-img.com/images/2020/02/15/_20200215_231001.jpg) Put another way.... Turn that little lot into Kwh and even halving it to be generous about better efficiency of EV.... Then think where that much extra electricity is going to be generated by the time fossil fuels are reduced to near nothing in less than 30 years.... All while replacing natural gas and struggling with obselete generation plant...... How long has it taken to not yet build one extra power station??  .... There's going to be a lot less driving being done if the targets are actually going to be met ... Enjoy private car ownership while you can K
Last edited by Image; 15/02/20 11:24 PM.
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Joined: Mar 2012
Posts: 4,491 Likes: 65
Part of the Furniture
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Part of the Furniture
Joined: Mar 2012
Posts: 4,491 Likes: 65 |
There's a fair amount of biogas already in the network, I am on a Green Gas tariff from Ecotricity. Not sure you could put hydrogen though the existing pipes though. BBC sounds World of Business programme on this - might need BBC login https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/p07zv8vq
2021 Lapis Blue Plus 6  You know it makes sense!  2016 Carmine Red 991.2 C4S
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Joined: Apr 2011
Posts: 8,646
Needs to Get Out More!
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Needs to Get Out More!
Joined: Apr 2011
Posts: 8,646 |
Well, judging by this article in the latest Autocar, more exciting offerings will be available on the electric car front very shortly. ![[Linked Image]](https://www.tm-img.com/images/2020/02/16/4193D2C7-0D87-41BB-9584-F0776D79D494.jpg) ![[Linked Image]](https://www.tm-img.com/images/2020/02/16/4985D458-73FD-4400-A48B-BFD7DB1E94AC.jpg)
Giles. Mogless in Paris.
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Joined: Oct 2019
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Posts: 5,041 Likes: 312 |
As an EV is a non-runner for me for reasons I have posted before I'm not intensely focused on them.... I do find it interesting that the majority response I see from the manufacturers to a population-wide crisis in transport seems largely focused on vanity toys for the well - heeled..... Over-priced, over-performing, over-specified luxury toys for the over-monied.
I'll believe they're taking it seriously when we see an EV Dacia Duster at £6k.... Or have they worked out that mass transport will be uberised, public and non mechanised for the huge mass of urban dwellers, with personal ownership heavily taxed and weighted into 'luxury' status.?
K
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Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 11,854 Likes: 137
Scruffy Oik Member of the Inner Circle
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Scruffy Oik Member of the Inner Circle
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 11,854 Likes: 137 |
have they worked out that mass transport will be uberised, public and non mechanised for the huge mass of urban dwellers, with personal ownership heavily taxed and weighted into 'luxury' status.?
I think this is exactly the future of personal transport. The combination of flexible timetabling with uber-style ride-hailing apps for buses like they already have in Oxford and Liverpool, together with subscription based car sharing/hire schemes will make private car ownership an unattractive proposition for most people.
Tim H.
1986 4/4 VVTi Sport, 2002 LR Defender, 2022 Mini Cooper SE
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Joined: Oct 2019
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Charter Member
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I may well be past caring by the time it really bites, but their model doesn't bode well for the likes of me and many other rural dwellers (mile up a forest track from the nearest tarmac, 8 mile round trip to a village with a poor bus service and a 90 mile round trip to a useable train station)..... Mog is a 4 seater tho so an LPG conversion to run on biogas might work as there's space for the tank in the back easy enough.... My wife regularly tells me I'm full of sh*t so maybe I should invest in my own methane plant to make use of my conversational skills K
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Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 11,854 Likes: 137
Scruffy Oik Member of the Inner Circle
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Scruffy Oik Member of the Inner Circle
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 11,854 Likes: 137 |
I may well be past caring by the time it really bites, but their model doesn't bode well for the likes of me and many other rural dwellers (mile up a forest track from the nearest tarmac, 8 mile round trip to a village with a poor bus service and a 90 mile round trip to a useable train station)..... Mog is a 4 seater tho so an LPG conversion to run on biogas might work as there's space for the tank in the back easy enough.... My wife regularly tells me I'm full of sh*t so maybe I should invest in my own methane plant to make use of my conversational skills K Yes, I think ultra-rural dwellers like yourself will still be running round in old Land Rovers and the like for many decades to come, there really isn't much alternative. We don't currently have a bus service, but we're only a few miles from town, and the Parish Development Group is already formulating a community transport policy. When we're too old and doddery to be trusted behind the wheel of a car, Jane and I are planning to get a couple of those off-road buggies.
Tim H.
1986 4/4 VVTi Sport, 2002 LR Defender, 2022 Mini Cooper SE
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Joined: Oct 2019
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Charter Member
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Charter Member
Joined: Oct 2019
Posts: 5,041 Likes: 312 |
I think we'll see lots of innovative technological and social realignments.... In spite of my lifelong love affair with petrol driven things I'm no Luddite.... (sorry Luddite ).... I think it will be interesting times. Provided we don't have urban-centric decision makers ignoring anyone beyond the concrete with 'one size fits all' rules to placate the 'Thunbergians' regardless of realities, my main worry, strangely, is unchecked activism.... A mix of Class-War (aka Generational War) and Planet-Saviourism is heady stuff for the cycle riding successors of ER.... Antifa style groups (ANTI-CA © got in quick and copyrighted that one, could pay to put Tesla bits under the Defender  )..... ICE tyre-slashing and violent beating and screaming of 'Die Boomer' at anyone daring to stop at a petrol station would be exciting and totally justifiable to the reightious heirs to Climate Activism... Could make owning an ICE car unviable long before legislation and lack of fuel. K
Last edited by Image; 16/02/20 12:55 PM.
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Joined: Jan 2010
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Talk Morgan Enthusiast
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Talk Morgan Enthusiast
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 1,793 Likes: 47 |
There's a fair amount of biogas already in the network, I am on a Green Gas tariff from Ecotricity. Not sure you could put hydrogen though the existing pipes though. There is testing underway now, with the aim of converting the UK gas networks to 100% hydrogen.... https://www.h21.green
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Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 11,854 Likes: 137
Scruffy Oik Member of the Inner Circle
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Scruffy Oik Member of the Inner Circle
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 11,854 Likes: 137 |
There is testing underway now, with the aim of converting the UK gas networks to 100% hydrogen.... https://www.h21.greenFascinating stuff. I didn't realise the old town gas used to be 50% Hydrogen. This would be massive leap forward if they could make it work.
Tim H.
1986 4/4 VVTi Sport, 2002 LR Defender, 2022 Mini Cooper SE
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