Talk Morgan Forums Morgan Sports Cars Maintenance & Servicing Series 1 Roadster - Sump

I see it as a deflector plate and can see it saving an object hitting the bluff end of the sump with force and maybe the car would ride up onto the sump instead of smashing it, so a good idea I would have thought.
Always good to see someone improving another designed in MMC error.

Years ago I had a brilliant idea for making a stubble valance, obviously not the most difficult job in the world. Careful measurement so that it would fit between my overriders I used quality 2.5mm aluminium sheet, a present to self from my firms stock when retiring, all the best tools at my command….Black and Decker workbench, Bosch hand drill c/w blunt drills, quality plastic rainwater pipe to act as a mandrel for that “oh so sophisticated look”………..et voila. A trial fit determined err…..it looked like Frankensteins ugly brother.

A narrow bodied 4/4 with overriders and my valance didn’t do it for me. I still have nightmares.

So, what to do with my wonderful creation, my baby, born from the sweat of my brow. After all I couldn’t give it away…honest.

Brilliant idea number 2! Drill another couple of holes and bolt it to the radiators bottom fixing brackets, lots of room there.

So, I now have a “snowplough” with multi function…. It steers air up in front of the rad for cooling. It also creates a vacuum at the back of the plate so hot air is pulled from underneath the rad. It keeps the rack clean. It keeps the sump clean. It gives millisecond early warning (screech) when you have gone over something and it’s about to hit the sump. It keeps light debris from hitting the sump.

Clearly, the “snowplough” is a must. I’m proud to say mine is a piece of craftsmanship, thoughtful design and technical development bordering on the brilliant. The Sifab company I’m sure would be proud of me.

As you can tell my wife has nobbled the tv and I’m forced to watch Strictly. Think I’ll make something

I’m sure that you are seconds away from selling the design rights. It sounds brilliant.

Working 2.5mm aluminium is truly impressive.

Dave, maybe a silly idea but could you boost the deflector's strength by resin bonding on a few layers of cheap ebay kevlar/carbon fibre fabric?

Not sure it would stick well enough Rog. I haven't tested it but I think the flat section would take a trolley jack without bending, because the curve gives it considerable strength.
I don't envisage riding up over an "obstruction" because the sump wouldn't take it. But it's a worthwhile additional barrier for deflecting general road detritus.

Thanks for responding Paul. Good to have your opinion. But simply look at the images. (I added below that I use to show what NOT to do on GoMoG) With ground clearance, every millimetre counts. As well, every change has ancillary effects, what I call the Deadly Domino Effect..aka the spread of unwanted results to other areas from what is presumed to be a "fix" for another area.

The most salient characteristic of we amateurs is that we make magic of things that are merely common sense..or refuse the evidence of our eyes. Peter Mulberry once told me of a early Roadster with nothing done to the sump area who hit a gate's inground hardware, smashed the sump to pieces while pushing the engine into the transmission (to sad effect) and further deflected to impact force into the differential, ruining that as well. (ugh)

What do you believe the aluminum plate will deflect the impact forces into...?? Any impact force, sufficient (we all agree) to shatter the Roadster sump will do if you place a plate of aluminum ON or next to the sump and whack it will be fully transferred, undiminished, into the sump!!

You will also notice that the plate is attached to the all important but very thin flange at the chassis frame at both sides! If that flange splits, traditionally the hefty vertical section of the frame will soon follow. And history has shown us that there is no perfect fix for a split frame except a frame replacement. (ugh) Over time a Morgan weld causes splits at its edges.

My apologies DaveW. I have no wish to dampen your enthusiasm and fun. I enjoy them. As I have written many times, I have a great (massive) respect for anyone who works on their Morgan. However, the format used here, (my main thrust) and the reluctance to consult with the forum before and while trying a "fix" can make anyone dangerous to other owners with their results. There are many examples here..(even another in the last week). Why deny this group, and the gurus who have been working on these cars for a century, any input into your work and thoughts? You AND THIS GROUP would be much better for it..along with everyone gaining a learning experience and having more fun.

As I said, at a glance, the best solution is a steel sump or the Mulberry solution if none is available.

Lorne

Apologies, thread drift, but this thread seemed to call out for it.

Who likes famous quotations?
I do.. my favourite is one by Mark Twain, or at least attributed to him.

“Never argue with an idiot. They will drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.”

Yes, +8Rich. But this one is more a function of cost saving again rather than another design error. If it is a Ford Escape sump, one must consider that the Escape has a 7.8 inches (almost 200 mm) ground clearance. DaveW mentioned his clearance is 3.625 inches, a difference of 4 inches or more than 100mm! That makes the clearance perfectly all right for the donor vehicle but a disaster waiting to happen with the Roadsters (and other cars using the sump) without proper remedial measures. Should the MMC be blamed for a bad "design" in this area or merely penny-pinching again. A steel stamped out or crafted sump is not expensive, especially in quantity, though individual bespoke sumps are beyond most amateurs working alone. On eMog, when encountered such impasse, we mandated one of us to do a group design and buy. After all, It is no more difficult than arranging for a group badge. For example, a group manufacture and buy in large numbers was done by a charming Australian fellow and sold in 100s around the world without profit. Why don't you all properly fix this issue for good??? I am sure the other sports cars (Alfa Romeo) with this version of the engine would buy as well. BTW, THEIR sump guard leaves lots of space between guard and sump. Check it out.

That would give the aftermarket fellas who use this forum for advertising a new profit centre! In the past, that was how it all worked with Morgans....a synergy between the Works, the trade side and owners.

As Peter Morgan once said (reputedly). "I give Morgan buyers a start. It is for them to finish the car as they wish." Of course, the originality crowd shiver at that one!!

L.

Gomog, you seem to have missed the point of Dave W's contraption. The clue is in the word plough. The idea is that it might sweep away a small obstacle, there's no claim that it will absorb head on impacts. Anything that reduces the anxiety of minute road clearance on the early roadster is definitely a good idea.
In my opinion the sump being so low on modern Mogs is driven by the legal requirements to increase the distance between the bonnet and the top of the engine...to protect any pedestrian who finds themselves resting on it suddenly at speed.
Nick