Talk Morgan Forums Community The Malvern Arms car hoarding for the kids?

I'm offsetting the carbon from my Plus 8 by driving a Tesla M3.

Rotate fifteen years forward and ask them how they feel about you having left them

1) 2019 Hyundai Ioniq (quite smart so not meant in a rude manner)
2) 19XX Morgan (Anything, even them funny Aluminium ones)

I know which one they are going to reach for the keys of first. Their perspective will be different to ours and something special like a Mog will be way more special.

Mind you depending on how well you have loved/developed/trained them it might just be so they can sell a VERY valuable ICE historic item.

Tim the 45k came from a bbc article. How true it is I don't know. I merely point out that scrapping what you have as an ice car and buying new is not necessarily the best option.

This weekend I went to see my MGB. The workshop owners son did an economics degree. For a paper he got the weight of the MGB parts that are used in the MX5 engine based rebuild and worked out the CO2 saving for those parts as they don't need to get the raw material and build the body. He then worked out the CO2 cost of a Tesla 3. The figures worked out that I can drive my MGB for 96,000km before it catches up. Seeing I expect I will do somewhere around 5,000km a year in that car that is about 20 years. By then I expect there will be a good electric/Hydrogen option to have the car rebuilt again with.

In less than a week my son turns 25. I had told him in the past my plan was to buy a Morgan and give him my Silvia Convertible when he turns 25. Unfortunately it got written off in a hail storm in 2020, I ended up letting the insurance company take it and I bought a Skoda Rapid that my wife loves and ordering the MGB, the Skoda Octavia that was sort of my wife's car is now mainly my car. While away he reminded me that if the car had not been written off it would be his very soon.

As far as hoarding a car for him it has been a much better investment to buy a house for him, his girlfriend and daughter to live in. As Richard said invest in bricks and mortar, or in my opinion invest in the land the bricks and mortar are on as that is what mainly goes up in value.

As far as hoarding a car he would like for sentimental reasons I should have kept the Silvia Convertible and not claimed the insurance.

One of the reasons for not keeping the Silvia was the expense of having so many cars. I am paying rego and insurance on the MGB, three Skoda's (my Octavia, Wife's new Skoda Rapid and her old Skoda Rapid that my son drives to work etc.). I am also paying the insurance on my sons Silvia hardtop that has a stack of engine modifications and the insurance on the Toyota RAV4 his girlfriend drives our granddaughter around in. I organised the insurance for both and have been paying it since. Yes they should pay it themselves but they can't really afford to pay their childcare, rent to me and other bills as it is.

I feel very sad the Silvia Convertible went, I loved driving it with the roof off and he was driven to school in it every day as I got it when he first started Kindergarten.

I expect when Howard started this post he really wanted people to say, Howard go and get an E-Type Jaguar for yourself to have fun in and justify it as a great investment to leave to your kids because they have gone up in value some much and they will keep going up in value. But I hope to live another 25 years or so and I feel cars would have changed so much by then, plus what people with money will want to own in 25 years will have changed and I am not convinced those cars will be worth a lot at that time. They are not bought for practical reasons so their value is based on supply and demand (which is really just desire as no-body needs an E-type Jag), supply will go down but will demand go up or plummet?

Say I live for another 25 years then my son will inherit probably two paid off houses and say $1.2M in my super. If I had kept the Silvia and paid the expenses of keeping it maybe he might inherit two paid off houses and $1M in super. No way in 25 years would the Silvia be worth $200K to sell but it could be worth that to him for sentimental reasons and his view might be he would rather the car because he is getting enough other assets, or he might think dad made the hard but right choice to all the Silvia to be written off because he did well financially and left me very well setup.

From Luddites post earlier:

"There seemed to be tax avoidance advantages associated with passing on wealth to the kids in the form of Classics, however I suspect there may be some officials somewhare looking at many aspects of increasing taxation as part of a Covid recovery option, and which may in time attempt to close any such ...err...loopholes in the systems..?"

Something I hadn't given much consideration to, however it may well be worth investigating until that loophole is closed? If for no other reason than it will give me an excuse to garner a few more toys.

As far as the ICE v Electric debate is concerned, all I can say is that my new electric MG5, whilst very very bland to look at, is an absolutely stupendous vehicle for all the running around journeys I do. Quiet, easy to drive, cheap (ish) to fuel, comfortable, and it appears to be well made, but time will tell on that. Once price, range and charging time have been sorted out, there is no doubt they will be the vehicle of choice irrespective of government legislation in 2030, they are getting that good.

The under 45's now just want a means of transport, not a whole hobby as we do. I guess my son is typical - at 46 he has grown up with a true petrol head dad, but he just isn't interested in cars, except to get around in, He has a Skoda Fabia estate as the family car and a VW camper van to go surfing and cycling in. They are always filthy, as he says he has better things to do than spend a Sunday morning cleaning and polishing. Frankly it is hard to argue. I think he is typical of his generation too.

This whole thing will undoubtedly have implications for the likes of Morgan, Caterham and Lotus in the future, unless they can come up with something a whole lot different.

As for what to leave my son, sadly he will only get the Morgan, which I suspect he will move on pdq. However, as Rich has said, it's still all about bricks and mortar (and land), so that will be what will keep him and his family comfortable for a few years when I'm gone.

I have similar experience with younger friends who are just not at all moved by cars ... just a travel pod to them (I guess they take mobility for granted, whereas for us even an old banger had legendary status for the unprecedented mobility and social opportunities it gifted us) .... my nephews and neices are just old enough to appreciate an interesting and engaging car but less so than us older drivers, so I wonder if that can survive in the face of the anti-ICE publicity onslaught that is sure to start soon (it will take a committed and single minded petrol-head to withstand the coming peer pressure) .... developments in synthetic neutral fuels might take the heat off obvious classics where carbon neutrality of the fuel (or near so) coupled with the amortisation of their lower construction burden can be sold as a good thing.

As for Morgan, Caterham and Lotus .... all they need to do is keep doing what they do now and they'll be decidedly different in 20 years time!! 😁... the transportation world is turning fast!



K

My understanding is that ANY asset left in a will is taxed on the basis of a "hands off" valuation.
Ir doesn't matter if it is art, property, classic car, wine, whatever, the value of the estate is calculated and death duties paid on the value above the threshold.

If you have monies in a SIPP it can be passed to someone who has a SIPP, without taxation. But of course when they draw it down it will be taxed...

The only way to avoid inheritance taxation is to die penniless is to gift the money now and live 7 years.
Would you give your son your house? Remember, he can evict you and make you homeless...

cars contribute 16% of total CO2 emissions here in the UK - roughly the same as residential. The government doesnt even mention in their stats the CO2 put out by human beings breathing and its more than you might think.

But leaving that aside, I was trying to get a clear view of the future for what we now class as classic cars. Will we be allowed even to use them - my guess is yes but this might be limited in cities by councils who have got the new religion. Will they be of value since classic cars seem usually to be those cars that the 50 to 70 generation of men fancied when younger, so the hot cars move on as people age. Will our kids even be interested - after all driving for most has changed from being something that might generate enthusiasm into an over regulated over jammed chore.

Hi
With utmost respect (and don’t want to be confrontational nor cause offence) you may not be correct re the pension stuff (ie Sipp).
Pensions in general (a few odd exceptions exist) are normally out of one’s estate as they are held in a Trust (you indicate via a nomination of beneficiary form who gets the fund on death whether deceased pre or post retirement eg in FAD) so are not assessed for IHT purposes. There are different tax treatments for beneficiaries, on withdrawal, if inherited pre or post 75. I won’t go into the trust arrangements for pensions as gets more complicated/confusing. I’m not referring to Final Salary/DB schemes, only what are known as DC (defined contribution) schemes.
If I misunderstood your post I sincerely apologise and please note this not advice (see your regulated and authorised IFA) but pensions are frequently a bloomin’ brilliant way of doing estate planning and passing wealth onwards on death…
Kind regards
HB

Paul,
Do keep us up to date on that. Will be interesting to see how you get on, long term.