Talk Morgan Forums Community Vehicle Talk (non-Morgan) Howards Dillema...Almost.

Chat gpt simply broused everything on the web before Jan this year. You have to pay for vs 4, for exploring capability the free version is enough.
I asked it to review a paper I published in early 2017, and produce a 400 word summary.

This is it....

The importance of analytical data quality is indisputable, forming the core theme of this article. A robust quality system is integral to quality data, with reference materials playing a crucial role in underpinning such systems. However, despite efforts from organizations like ISO and ILAC, not all reference materials are equal, necessitating vigilance in their selection.

Certified reference materials are often considered of the highest metrological status, with National Metrology Institutes and accredited producers being key sources. The accreditation, particularly to ISO/IEC 17025 and ISO Guide 34, indicates competence in measurement and reference material production. However, the absence of legal mandates beyond ISO standards allows entities to dub anything as certified reference material, demanding a discerning eye from Quality Managers.

The chaos in the market arises from varied representations and misrepresentations. Some accredited producers stretch rules, marketing non-certified reference materials alongside certified ones. The presence of ISO 9001 Certification, while indicating a quality system, is irrelevant to reference material production.

The article stresses the need for a Certificate of Analysis (COA) accompanying certified reference materials. Specific elements on the COA, such as certified property values with uncertainty statements, traceability, homogeneity, stability details, and accreditation marks, are crucial indicators of legitimacy. Additionally, examining the producer's scope, which outlines accredited tests and materials, is vital, as products outside this scope cannot be deemed certified reference materials.

The article advises against relying solely on claims of adherence to ISO standards without supporting evidence of accreditation. It emphasizes the importance of evaluating each certified reference material based on intended use, completeness, clarity of documentation, and the reputation of the producing company.

In conclusion, not all certified reference materials are of equal quality. The accompanying documentation, especially the COA, varies among accredited producers. To avoid issues with accreditation bodies, thorough evaluation of each certified reference material based on specific criteria is essential for ensuring data quality in analytical processes.


Not a bad effort. This is the original...
https://www.spectroscopyeurope.com/quality/confidence-key-quality

This thread seems to have tapped into the Chat AI debate .... with both the poems and the summary above it seems that the Bot can do a decent job of cobbling together the results of an automatic web search.

We look at these and think 'decent effort' ... but that's because we have the context to judge them.

In the same way that we sometimes pick up the cosmic mistakes of those who have only ever used a calculator and therefore lack the basic mental arithmetic that tells us "that can't be right" when a finger fault or misplaced decimal puts the answer orders of magnitude out ... in spite of the answer being accepted without question by the button presser .... how long before a significant number of people won't have ever researched anything for themselves and accept AI generated copy as gospel without the 'context' to question it??

K

,

I note the AI was not that bright, it didn't detect its audience, using the American spelling of tires rather than UK of tyres.

I note the reference ''that can't be right', a failing for example many users have when using spreadsheets and relying on its calculations without reference to independent check totals/boxes, that verified the the calculations by cross reference to other cells to check the output answer was correct via a different calculation/algorithm. I never trusted spreadsheet outcomes that didn't feature check totals/boxes.

The question does rise if the AI is using the internet as the source of its material, how can you independently check the AI output if most of the material you have access to is held on the same internet. (other than sanity checks).........there comes a point at some time in the future when most likely the body of evidence supporting the AI output does becomes de facto gospel, especially as more and more of the body of supporting evidence becomes AI generated.

Talk Morgan said " With a practical hat on, a Ferrari will generally cost more to run, maintain and insure than a comparable contemporary; however, the argument is that it will also more than likely hold a much higher residual value.". As I have said before it doesnt seem to cost any more for the V8s than a similar Audi or Merc. My insurance is £250, tyres are cheaper than many modern cars. The residual comment is dodgy - Ferrari values go up and down like other collectables. Two pals with 328 models have seen their cars go from the £20k purchase price ( second hand - new in the 80s they were about £80k) up again to £80k and currently dropping like a stone. Yes you can defy depreciation with the "special " models as you can with a GT3 Porker but not the ordinary cars.

Talk Morgan also said " The other element, which I do not believe has been mentioned, which is interesting given the community, is the perception and reaction of other road users. I have never owned a Ferrari but the experiences I have had as a passenger in them made me wonder if the world had gone mad; never have I been in a car that caused such a diverse reaction. ". I would put it differently. I have never experienced the negatives and thank god I have never had the boy racer challenging to a drag race as I often got in the Lotus. I do find that people let me out of junctions, do ask me to rev the car in tunnels and little boys give thumbs up. Most surprising is the number of middl;e aged women who ask for a drive in it! Never had a negative reaction but a lot more people just ignore the 360 than ever did the 430 I had before it. The 430 was almost identical body shape but it was red not TDF Blu.

But in the end owning a performance car of any sort is for me, all about performance. As a young man I could thrash the nuts of my Triumph Spitfire easily able to make similar if not better journey times in it that I can now do in a Ferrari which has a top speed 3 times as great. Where's the point . I am the motoring equivalent of the eunuch in the harem. All that fun on offer but not able to take advantage.

Howard, do you not find that parts are more expensive than a modern equivalent vehicle costing a similar price? Or is the Ferrari tax a myth? General maintenance and servicing may be reasonable but I have been told horror stories about cost when major work is required. This includes a recent conversation with someone with a Mondial QV that cost half the value of the car (£20k on a £40k vehicle) just to do some, what would have been relatively minor work, on a current production car.

As for deprecation, my point was that comparing a modern car to a near classic must take into account how much new cars lose in the first part of the life-cycle. As we are all aware, most new cars will lose 50%+ of the initial purchase price in the first 2-3 years of ownership (ignoring the strangeness of the immediate years post-pandemic where many used cars were inflated). With a car such as the 360, values may fluctuate but are unlikely to be worth half of what you paid over a few year period (nor gain that value).

I lost an air suspension leg on the ML63 and the part was a couple of months and with fitting it came to over £2000. For a suspension unit.

Considering how old the Mondial is I am impressed you can still get parts. Lets not discuss the Aero in that respect shall we?

A memory of a cartoon posted behind the stores counter circa 35 years ago where I worked... perhaps applicable as the forerunner to some of the possibilities and so much more of A.I. ?
The scene is, a chap in overalls at the stores counter pointing at a shelf, behind the storeman, the storeman looking in his computer monitor, and saying, "the computer says we have none in stock" and the chap in overalls pointing saying "there IS one behind you on the shelf ! "

Back in the '80s one of salesmen that worked for the multinational company where was the New South Wales Customer Support Manager was a Porsche enthusiast. He took his car in for a major but routine service and came back somewhat in shock. I do not remember the exact figure that is cost him but it was more than a month's salary, translated to today's terms it would be over $10K. No wonder the poor guy was always scraping for cash: The car, his only transport, cost him more to own than he could really afford. His company car allowance and tax deduction of expenses would have helped a bit but they were geared around the cost of the average family sedan.
I have heard that service costs on Porsches have now been reduced to much more reasonable figures but back then just the cost of ownership put a Porsche out of my reach and I had a well above average income.

An oil change in a Cayenne costs €850. An hour's service at the Porsche Centre costs around €300. That's not very cheap.

In the twelve years I owned my 430 I don’t recall too much expense. In my house I try not let these details attract attention, if you want the true answer I’d need to look under the rug beneath which they were swept.
Like Howard, I’ve never yet experienced any unpleasantness while using my Ferrari, in fact the very opposite or complete indifference is the typical reaction.