Talk Morgan Forums Morgan Sports Cars Morgan Three Wheeler & Super 3 Engine Temperature Sensor (ETS)

I recently had what turned out to be an ETS failure whilst on the Northern Spain tour.

The symptoms were check engine light, the car running slightly rough below 3,000 but sweet as a nut above, very hard to start when hot, requiring part throttle and at least 4-5 goes at starting. When it did catch it ran very rough with copious quantities of black smoke from both exhausts which then cleaned up after about 10-20 seconds. It was obviously running very rich and we tried changing the Idle Air Valve. This was a temporary cure but within 10 miles or so the engine light was back on. Next changed the Inlet Manifold temperature sensor and again the "fix" only lasted a few miles. Lastly tried the ETS which, although an early suspect, was initially ruled out as it's pretty much solid state and we'd not heard of them failing. This (so far) seems to have cured the problem.

For the Alternative parts list it's a Cylinder Head Temperature Sensor, OEM reference 32446-99 and common fitment for Harleys. Available from Hogparts, part number 990954

https://www.hogparts.co.uk/motorcyc...-1999-2016-flt-touring-inj-models-p75245

Sorry to read of your issues while touring.... On your temp sensor issue, I wonder if it for future reference, it might be thought worthwhile to measure the resistance reading across the terminals of your new sensor, once unplugged, at "cold" and "normal! running temps...?

As another afterthought, I wonder if it is possible to check the signal voltage on the plug with the ign on and sender unplugged.....?

Any and all, or none of which might be thought helpful in the future..?

I guess if one carries a code reader as opposed to a multimeter, then it might point directly to any sensor out of range...?

Just thinking in type..

I guess whilst on tour Chris you didn't have access to Protune to check out fault code. Did you get opportunity to check it out when you got home

Not aware of any simple portable plug-in to view fault codes being a bespoke USB access system. Thankfully there is now an internationally adopted CANBUS standard for motorcycles using a 6 pin OBD2 diagnostic port for which an adaptor lead is required to allow use of 16 pin car type scanner systems.

Thanks Luddite, the easiest way to access the sensors is with the S&S Protune software (available free).

Richard, no I didn't have Protune for most of the tour but did stop by at M3WServices France. Due to limited time Steve was only able to check the sensors whilst the car was stationary and still hot. There was a stored P0118 fault code (high engine temp) but nothing live. Once cleared the fault code didn't return whist Protune was connected. The ETS looked to be working OK with the temp rising from about 170f to 200f at which point the fan came on. For a number of reasons we then suspected the intake temperature sensor and changed that which seem to solve the problem. However after leaving it became clear it hadn't so the other likely faulty sensor was the ETS.

When I got home I ran it with Protune from a cold engine and the problem showed fairly quickly between about 71f (ambient) and about 140f when it started fluctuating then going down rapidly until at one point showed -4f ! On Protune the measured temp then flashed red and defaulted to a fixed 100f. So it appeared the original sensor was faulty somewhere around 140f and when we tested it at M3WServices it was probably working again.

Code reader
If only...

Guess I am just displaying my lack of knowledge on the M3W and much else, I guess trying to find room for a code reader on a M3W trip to foreign parts could be somewhat tricky were one such available...? Though I have read of dongles and mobile phone systems that can operate with standard OBII programming...

The code readers I have seen use the OBDC connector but the M3W ecu has a mini or type C usb port depending on age. Also code readers give the the error codes whereas Protune shows the sensor and live parameter readings. Protune does require a laptop but for longer tours someone often has one with them.

All interesting stuff with detailing the diagnosis Chris. The initial "guess" at it being a faulty Engine Temp Sensor was correct in the end, the cooling fan switching being a bit erratic as well. Thanks for the part number info, to be added to the next APL update. Glad you have got it running nicely again.

Thanks for taking the time to reply to my rambling Chris99. I missed your initial response throwing some more light on the situation. I claim ZERO expertise and more accurately as my chosen forum I.D. suggests , I am all too easily frustrated by the necessary digitisation involved in the average ICE these days.

I guess when travelling in pre arranged company with other Morganeers it seems wise to organise some sort of sharing of "tools" and or parts amongst the group...? Using nothing more than simple logic, I am somewhat frustrated to think that in this day and age that a mobile phone might struggle to store the Protune data to be used in combination with a suitable dongle....which would make for a much more practical situation.

Interesting that it seems the ETS read out was found to be intermittent.... Having no idea of the construction of the device I am inclined to think of it as some sort of encapsulated thermistor, and that it seems to fail within a defined temperature range, would have me looking at the connections and wiring very carefully, perhaps more so on an engine where vibration is ...err...no stranger...?

I well remember over two decades back, trying to find space for tools and spares in our old +8 after my good lady had packed all her little essentials for our European trips... Happy days... (-:

As ever just passing time thinking in type..

It's always good to have as many opinions as possible

Unfortunately Protune is a windows only program although I did hear there is now a version for a Mac. It's not available as an App which I agree would be handy. However I doubt there's any chance of further development now S&S have sold the X-Wedge rights to China who have redeveloped the engine for their local manufacture and market.