Talk Morgan Forums Thread Like Summary - Brakes

I've a series 2 4/4, having bled brakes the left front wheel developed a tendency to lock up. I changed master cylinder, re-bled and changed front hoses, no difference.

Yesterday I removed both front hubs, bearings etc in very good condition (recent as in 10 years, renovation), but there were 4 newish looking girling cylinders, each had brake fluid coming out, just a small amount. Pads on right upper were glazed.

So I cleaned her up, cleaned cylinders, and a little better but still locks up.

I've ordered 4 x new girling cylinders to replace this week, a new master cylinder again (not convinced on the one I was given with car) and a new rear brake line.

All spirngs are good inside the brakes, all mechanisms seem to be working fine.

I've bled it about 10 times (properly with both foot/helper method and vaccum pressure system) so not sure if a stubborn bubble in the metal line from right to left front brake.

I've not gone near the rears as yet.

The cylinders are cheap enough to replace, so sensible, but any thoughts?

Send your old cylinders to Past Parts to have them bored and stainless sleeve fitting - will save the regular replacement of cylinders in the future.

Might be wrong but that shoe/spring setup doesn't look right and certainly not symmetrical. See below image from 1953 plus 4.

I'm with Graham here, my 2010 plus 4 has the cylinders stainless lined from past parts, Bought new cylinders and sent them straight there. Before this my cylinders seized over winter every year, now since 2022 they have worked perfectly and the standard cylinder repair kits fit the lined cylinders so any wear and its just a quick service at £12 per side although as yet I haven't needed to carry this out. Now, I service my car diligently and change my brake fluid annually. Check moisture content throughout the year yet still the cylinders would gum up without fail. so my advice to any classic owner would be to line the cylinders! First used on racing cars for its bomb proof reliability they really do help.

Not sure what brake distribution system you have fitted but try a back bleed through each cylinder nipple to see if you can get some flow. If all ok then i'd suspect your mechanical side. Shoe friction material thicknesses, spring strength, shoe retaining locators and lubrication against back plate. Something is locking them up when fully applied then released. Just use a rubber or nylon mallet to tap the shoes from side to side at each cylinder. As you move one across the other side should move out the same amount and then back again, this should move easily with little resistance and good cylinders will move with hand pressure even when fully assembled. If they don't I reckon the cylinders are gummed up. I have written previous posts on how to rectify this but come back if you find a problem with this.

Just as an aside, when I first got my Mog I drove it for the first few months when clearly the rear cylinders were seized and no brake effort was being delivered to either rear wheel....... car performed fine, however when I rectified this, (I quickly took the car off the road for a major work-over as so many things were just frankly blooody awful!) I have to say I could not feel any improved breaking effort or flatness in the brake feel. The only thing that has changed is, if breaking hard in the wet the back end can twitch a bit, although not unmanageable, mind you a 1990's Golf Gti makes anything feel good in the wet when being compared with it!

The Morgan set up is really quite primitive and a methodical approach will soon get you sorted out. Just one last thing. I have come across cylinders that look like they are leaking just a little but its been the lubrication applied to the piston seals and often the excess amount stuffed under the dust covers trying to stop them seizing that is wet. I'm starting to believe that some of the lubricants that are used might be the cause of this gumming up and have reverted to the old school use of brake fluid as a lubricant on assembly and then a very small amount of red rubber grease to the lips of the dust cover (both cylinder and piston) which seems to be quite effective in keeping water at bay but not causing harm. I'm sure many here will come up with a suggestion as to which assembly product to use but I have to say I started working on cars from the end of the 60's and I have never seen as many wheel cylinder problems since all these new fangled brake lubricants have been foisted on the market.... I'm coming around to the ... if it aint broke mentality here!

That's a full day of work, 4 x new front cylinders, new master cylinder, much better and more "bouncy". New rear hose (misses the metal wrap which would have been helpful. I need to bleed again in the morning, as still spongy, but much better. A slight pull to left now (swapped top and bottom pad) and aligned backplate a little, greases everying up and cleaned. I suspect if I adjust front right she will balance out. No locking.

A long day, 12 hours of work! Can get a drum off in about 3 minutes now and getting quite good with the old split pins!

Well done. isn't it funny how such simple brakes can cause such unfathomable problems. I think it's partly down to how we view the Morgan, We see them as precious and tend to baby around a bit too much whereas when these things we standard fitment we just got on with it!