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Re : If only someone could explain how I am supposed to access the fill hole in the bevel box all would be just peachy!

http://www.talkmorgan.com/ubbthreads.php/topics/180158/Steps_on_changing_the_bevel_bo#Post180158

Work through to page two on this thread , and its orange plastic cap - you cant miss it !

I am lucky enough to own a fault free late 2013 M3W , fingers are crossed and touching wood as I write this.

I have a 2013 model with all the upgrades fitted. So apart from the chassis I would think almost a 2014 specification car. At this moment in time, my only complaint with my car is a bevel box whine at 50mph, I have had the NVH upgrade fitted, doesn't seem to have done much for my car. That is my only negative. My upgrades were done at the factory and I had excellent customer service.

As for buying my M3W I have absolutely no regrets! There is nothing on the market like it. I would suggest you look forward to the arrival of a very special fun car.

Dan,

I treat the castor like rake & trail on a motorcycle. Empire's recommendation was to start at 8 degrees castor but I was shooting for 4 degrees. I think the stability of 8 degrees would be good on a hotrod car running the quarter mile but I prefer more nimble driving so shot for less. High trail numbers make a bike want to go in a straight line (as if you didn't know) but resists turning. That's how the Asian motorcycle manufacturers give their "V-twin clones" that big, heavy bike feel...over-exaggerated trail. I know many guys running street rods (T-buckets and such) that are running 2-3/4 to 3 degrees castor. At 85 mph, the little M3W is still a two-finger drive.

On the toe, I was shooting for zero when the car is up and going. Any flexing and settling should be close to zero. On front-wheel drive cars, the typically shoot for a little toe out as the dynamics are just the opposite...the front drive wheels are pulling the toe out back toward zero.

One of the better things about using the Empire kit is the steering geometry is the same from one side of the car to the other....which it was not as delivered.

Drive train...?

I've got a compensator that's sounded like its coming out of the car since the day I picked it up. If I keep the compensator "pinned" at either end of its travel (definite acceleration or deceleration), it calms down. As the car gets hotter, the sweet spot moves up in the rpm range. I went through a Morgan dealer and all Morgan would offer is 1/2 hour shop time to hole saw my bell housing and stick a grease zerk in my compensator (after driving two 1500 mile round trips to the dealer)...it was at that moment I came to terms with the fact that M3W owners in the US don't have warranty. As I understand it, Morgan allows a shop 8 hours to swap compensators and the various dealerships I've spoken with said that it requires about 3 times that to do the swap so the dealerships aren't real keen and advocating the proper fix only to lose money on the deal...and I don't blame them...but it does nothing to help my situation on a $55k car that was broke when I got it. I've got a Centa compensator on the way and I'll just fix it my damn self. The dealers don't like the fact that I'm a DIY guy as they want to use people like me to beat Morgan over the head to negotiate more shop time for the repair...but I don't have time for their politics and games. It will also give me an opportunity to re-route the poorly routed oil lines and wiring harnesses. Anybody that rides a motorcycle knows that things won't last rubbing on sharp corners, etc. like my oil lines were and god know what else is. I may as well go ahead and get interment with the car see that I don't really have a warranty.


The bevel box...if you referred to it as the "hand grenade" in the back of the car, I'd know exactly what you were referring to. As you know, straight gears are louder than helical cut gears but that doesn't mean straight gears are weaker. As a fellow that has rebuilt/restored many old British bikes, I am familiar with Quaife gearboxes and I have some that are 40+ years old and are still going strong. I'm not sure if the Bevel Box is Quaife's best offering (which I highly doubt) or was it built to a price point (which I suspect). At any rate, when a straight gear box is in operation, it makes noise which is usually a consistent noise based on rpms. My bevel box makes noise but its a variety of different noises and not just a drone or whine. Just speculating as I have not pulled it yet, I don't think that is a good indication of longevity. It's certainly not a NVH issue.

You being a motorcycle guy, you know that Morgan didn't pull out all the stops on the rear-end of the M3W. The car would have been better served with a shaft-driven, mono-shocked, rear end, single-sided swing-arm with a 16" back wheel. What is in it now is the very cheapest setup money can build instead of the best rear-end for the application. Not if but when it let's loose, I won't be going back with the same box expecting different results. In fact, I plan to pull the body and morph the proper swing-arm in it (already have the rear-end) and it will be shaft-driven all the way to the back wheel. And then, I can run a Run Flat rear tire and won't have to pull an axle to change the tire (5 lugs). With no real means to repair on the road, the M3W needs a Run-Flat worse than anything I've ever seen.

Bottom line is I'm going to have to break my car several times (in different departments) to get it fixed right. If the fixes are right, eventually, I will weed out all the delicate bits and end up with something will get there and back under it's own power.

But my paint job is beautiful.... I may have been ahead with time and money to have just bought the body work from Morgan and built the rest myself. I was thinking the M3W would be a good starting "core" for a ride like this but looking at the welds and fitment of the frame tubes, I may be wrong.

Z

Z, thanks for the details.

The 1800 Goldwing final drive is mono sided and supports a wider 16" I believe. The final drive on the newer 1800's is 2.75:1 ratio. I would not feel at all worried about that setup as a rear swing arm and drive setup. But I have no idea what you have in mind.

Also I think that the original Liberty Cyclecar Ace used a Goldwing rear swing arm setup.

Before the Centa option, I was thinking that a stack of maybe three of the BMW rear driveshaft rubber flex joints bolted up in series may be a good alternative to the HD type sliding ramp compensator.

My old '76 Shovelhead original compensator only had a little wear on it 8 years ago when I tore it down to restore. But at just 74"/1200cc, it was/is not a powerhouse. On the other hand lots of the CVO guys with the 110"/1802cc have had tons of issues and HD has come out with their 4th revision on the SE compensators. They're still an issue. Personally, on my 110", I've got 13k miles and knock on wood, I've not had any issues yet with mine.

I do think there's room for improvement on the M3W, but most people will just have to wait for MMC to come out with them.

I wish you good luck with what you've done now and with the new Centa compensator. I would be interested to know how long it takes you to change yours out. Please share that.

Are there already M3W owners who did I change the compensator by themselves ?

The gears in the Bevel Gearbox are Helical cut not Straight cut Zackybilly1. There are some pictures of the insides on this thread.

http://www.talkmorgan.com/ubbthreads.php/topics/186814/Re_Bevel_Box_Porn#Post186814

I like your rear suspension arm change ideas. I ended up with about 5 degrees caster and 1 degree negative camber with my Empire kit fit and it feels good to me. I have zero toe angle at the moment but your suggestion of a little toe in sounds reasonable, so I will try that soon.

The orange cap is a vent not the fill hole. I was able to fill the BB through the vent, but it took well over an hour (and a lot of spillage) due to the lack of a vent.

The fill hole is covered by a bolt with a 10mm hex. Unfortunately, that bolt is so close to a box section of frame that a socket wrench won't fit. I also tried a hex wrench, but the gusset on the frame won't allow me insert it. Finally, the NVH doesn't allow you access to the bolt from below. I'm going to have to try a stubby socket and hope it fits.

You must dismantled the NVH
Not so easy

Not easy! I watched Raphael do it on my car and passed tools whilst he said "oh dear" a lot! Very grateful dot com!

It really is awkward.

Bingo....you nailed it, Dan. Goldwing swing arms with final drive, rotor and calipers are cheap and plentiful. With all the trike conversions and new pull-offs, they range from $75-$150 for a complete unit with less than 100 miles on them. I've got a couple on the shelf as I have 4 Goldwings. Typically, the Goldwing crowd (that really ride) swap them out between 150-200K miles just for general principle...that coincides with about the time an alternator swap is due. I am also running RunFlat tires on the rear of my Wings (and a BattleAx rear tire on the front)...I'm getting close to 30K miles per set. It's nice being able to decide where you want to fix your tire when needed. A tire pressure monitoring system (TPMS) is a necessity as you may be riding on a flat and not know it.

Using the Goldwing swing-arm will also allow remotely adjustable pre-load on the shock so your ride height could be adjusted to match the load you are carrying...passenger, luggage, etc.. I haven't studied it too close yet but it may be possible to build a "cradle" that would bolt up to existing mounting points thereby not altering the frame...but if it comes down to it, I will alter it.

Dan...you know I'm only a day's ride from you...if you want to come drive a Morgan, I'll turn you loose in one. I've got plenty of extra beds here and know where to get the food. Although I ride motorcycles all over the country at the drop of a hat, let's just say I'm a little more than reluctant to drive the Morgan to your neck of the woods....actually, I'm reluctant to drive it to a neighboring town.



Using a Wing swing-arm would also allow the use of Centramatic's automatic wheel balancers.



Z