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Joined: Mar 2013
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Here a pair of taper roller bearings (14) spaced apart within the removable pinion housing, support the pinion shaft. From what I can see the Quaife bevel box employs similar pinion support to that of the proven Guzzi design, so I don't think you can lay the blame there.
Hmmmm ... your correct. Looks like a bit the same as the Quaife unit but somewhere need to be a difference because so far as I know the Guzzi units don't scream. Does someone know if the heart lines of the pinion and crown wheel are in the same line in the Qauife unit? Looks that in the BMW and Guzzi the pinion is lower as the crown wheel. But I only can see this from the drawing / picture so perhaps I'm wrong.
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Talk Morgan Enthusiast
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Talk Morgan Enthusiast
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Hi Laurens,Interesting post and although i am not an engineer as such, now it all makes sense.
The BMW unit has a fully supported pinion gear, and the Quaife unit does not.
But why would swap the oil in the Quaife unit at regular intervals?
After all, when was the last time you changed the oil in a car or a bike unit?
With the amount of 3 wheelers on the road at the moment, and that number growing would it be worth making an exploratory inquiry to BMW.
After all they make the engine for the +8 and above! As an engineer I beg to differ. Both Quaife and BMW are fully supported just in different ways. The BMW pinion is supported by a thrust ball bearing on the propshaft side of the pinion gear and a needle roller bearing on the other side of the pinion gear. The Quaife pinion is supported by 2 angular contact preloaded bearings both on the propshaft side of the pinion, which support the pinion in both the thrust and axial direction. The Quaife design is similar to most car differentials. So its just horses for courses. Now if you are asking is the Quaife preload set correctly, the fact that most bevel boxes seem to become noisier when hot would indicate that that the preload is insufficient.
Last edited by Rog G; 01/06/16 09:08 PM.
2021 M3W
2013 M3W - Sold
1971 4/4 2 Seater
1934 Sports
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Talk Morgan Sage
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Talk Morgan Sage
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Most interesting post Roger.
I am not an engineer. But what I read is that the devil is very much in the absolute detail.
Neil
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So then i comes down to incorrect or poor setup, and not bad design!
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So then i comes down to incorrect or poor setup, and not bad design! In that case it wouldn't be difficult to make it silent. But (so far as I know) even Garage 56 couldn't make a setup which didn't scream. So what is the cause of the screaming ?
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Just Getting Started
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Just Getting Started
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Oct 2014 build. 8k miles. tolerable noise below 75mph. earplugs recommended because of high pitched noise over 75mph. The noise was worse when it was new. Sprocket was replaced with a steel sprocket. No noticeable effect on noise. I don't know what a NVH kit is.
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Has a lot to Say!
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Has a lot to Say!
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Oct 2014 build. 8k miles. tolerable noise below 75mph. earplugs recommended because of high pitched noise over 75mph. The noise was worse when it was new. Sprocket was replaced with a steel sprocket. No noticeable effect on noise. I don't know what a NVH kit is. The noise and vibration retrofit kit for the bevel box mounting.
The Original Ken
11,000 miles.
2014 BMW R9T
2005 Saabaru
2005 Saabaru
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Talk Morgan Expert
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Talk Morgan Expert
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Noise, Vibration, Harshness
kirkusblog.com
2016 M3W John A Prestwich Special
1952 Ford 8N
1968 Honda CL175,and 2018 Ural Retro
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Has a lot to Say!
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Noise, Vibration, Harshness Or, my ex wife.
The Original Ken
11,000 miles.
2014 BMW R9T
2005 Saabaru
2005 Saabaru
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Joined: May 2011
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Talk Morgan Enthusiast
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Talk Morgan Enthusiast
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So then i comes down to incorrect or poor setup, and not bad design! In that case it wouldn't be difficult to make it silent. But (so far as I know) even Garage 56 couldn't make a setup which didn't scream. So what is the cause of the screaming ? Bwitched has rebuilt his box to be quiet http://www.talkmorgan.com/ubbthreads.php/topics/267875/Bevel_box_rebuild#Post267875Another thought on the difference between the BMW and Quaife bevel box is that the bearing arrangement in the Quaife design by virtue of the use of angular contact bearings means the pinion is supported for thrust in both the forward and reverse direction, whilst the BMW box appears to be only supported for thrust in the forward direction.
2021 M3W
2013 M3W - Sold
1971 4/4 2 Seater
1934 Sports
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