Talk Morgan Forums Community The Malvern Arms The end is nigh

So we scrap a load of perfectly good cars that don't hit EU5 and EU6. But we continue to drive EU3 etc. Mostly I don't care but when it is a block of cars so consistent and on this scale then we must be missing a trick.

How does this help the eco club ? We burnt the energy making them etc etc. At the end of the day we all know the test that they actually failed is total borrox otherwise people could hit that mpg number anyway. Our initial perspective is part of the cause of this mess.

Why not call them what they are EU4 and then do a tier 2 scrapage on them with the deflation built in. Offer people with really rotten older diesels the chance to buy them taxed and priced as EU4 dirty diesels cheaply. Someone like BCA and the government need to pull the fur back from their eyes.

At least then the mass of the cars manufacturing costs and impact are not utterly wasted.

Quite agree.

As a principle the hit should not be taken retrospectively by the consumer. If you want to reduce overall emissions then force the manufacturers to go even cleaner to balance overall emissions. They can do it if forced to. Like Steve said, most people get a car to lug them, their kids and their stuff from A to B. Our enthusiasm and passion for dirty noisy cars is a by-product of that. And there is good reason to believe that the Chinese and Indian governments would like a nice clean world for their children to live in as well so cleaner cars are not just a Western liberal do-gooder daydream. Rant over.

Some very good thought provoking ideas here - not rants!

Thanks - I too believe that is an awful lot which could be done to help with air pollution.

As an optimist I hope that ever more practical solutions will be found which Diesel driven motorists can easily buy into.

I still cannot see how the government will recover the tax lost from petrol and diesel when everyone is 'forced' into electric. Must be billions of income they face to lose.

My initial thoughts were that carbon based fuel will become super cheap when it has to compete with electric - but my guess is that the powers that be will either hike the road fund licence on all diesel and petrol cars still being used and also add more tax onto the purchase price at the filling stations.

Then of course there will be some form of tax on batteries or charging to cover the losses at the pumps.

I will be well into my seventies by 2040 so will have little need for anything but the cheapest form of transport - perhaps a TUK TUK as mentioned by Peter in another thread ............ the electric one of course.

Quite agree, but I suspect that a large part of the schemes cooked up by the Government are actually driven by the large motor manufacturers desperate to get people to buy new cars.

It is quite ludicrous from an ecological perspective, we need to transition to clean transport methods, and we need to do it relatively quickly - over the next 30 years or so, but this wholesale scrapping of vehilces is just nonsense.

Why not simply do the obvious, and offer retro-fitting of clean engines into existing vehicles? Because the manufacturers don't like the idea, that's why.

They've already thought of this one, it looks like they'll be moving to a road pricing model instead. Instead of paying fuel duty, you'll be paying to use roads, based on the demand (ie congestion) and the environmental impact.

Want to drive up the motorways or main arterial A roads, or take your car into a large town or city, then it's going to cost you. A bit less for rural B roads, but they will be levying it somehow.

Simple really a tax levy on mileage done per annum £'s/1000 miles nothing to do with on what roads forcing cheaper roads to contest.

It's effectively what you pay on fuel duty anyhow, the more miles you do the more fuel you use.

There won't be any free from tax fuels everyone will pay.

No boxes needing fitting to track cars no new massive government computer systems that won't work.

I agree generally about the total goal being change to fuel-cell or other more effective mediums. I just feel sick that because of a dodgy rulebook and some overly-aggressive marketing/deceit the cars themselves are being scrapped. They still have better emissions control than a massive amount of the cars that are being used every day. The y use less petrol than 80% of road vehicles as they are a modern engine.

In using yet more energy to scrap them we are compounding the problem. I doubt we even recover 80% of the materials never mind the energy and pollution etc.

Building the loss into the price and reclassifying them to the correct tax level would still make them attractive to a LOT of people.


Random thought generated from the comment re gov. computer systems that don't work. I do love a spot of anarchy. They work for us right ?

Can we personally tax those that produce programmes that are a shambles and burn our money without adequate value to us.

NHS Mail, NHS computerisation etc etc
Once a target has been set then the deal is struck.
When they miss by a factor of 100% we should be able to claw back our money. (evil mode off)

Okay - off to take my Xanax now....

Politicians and senior civil servants should be held accountable. But they never are.