Talk Morgan Forums Morgan Sports Cars Morgan Aero 8, 2012< Plus 8, SuperSports, Coupe & Aeromax Morgan in BBC Top Gear magazine

it still are only magazines, not science-proved comparisons, so they will always be "personal opinions"
but don't forget these guys compare cars all of the time

I found my Range a terrific car when I had it, if I drove one now: I would call it a boat

I did! Otherwise I be running around in a diesel Volvo C30 as a daily driver...

Cheers,

Boshly,

I must reply to your response to my post.

I felt that my post was well balanced.

As I see it the pedal car may only be a pedal car but it is designed for the most precious customer group that any marque could have - namely children. For that reason quality and safety need to be spot on - how would you like your 10 year old daughter to be driving a pedal car with no handbrake!

For the record my Aero which indeed had been well fettled by the factory is now up for sale again at RPM. I am therefore not alone.

Finally if one cannot present a view without being attacked thus then there is no point being a member of the forum.

Hi Robert,

Responses as below



I have already said I found some (most) of your points very reasoned.



The safety of my kids is paramount. However, firstly I would have no problems with my 8 year old daughter driving a pedal car with no handbrake, I doubt she could pedal more than 6/7 mph and I can't see the issue. For her first cycling year she couldn't operate the brakes on her bike. Though without a doubt having operational brakes will always be better.

Secondly and more importantly this wasn't the point. The point was that you wouldn't buy a car from MMC as they had forgotten to reattach a handbrake to a pedal car.



If you read my post, you will see quite clearly that I am well aware you are not alone. Morgans, as per many specialist cars, need a certain understanding.

Interesting also that only yesterday I looked at a nice manual 2004 996TT X50 whilst browsing (as one does) which is for sale @36k miles with 6 previous owners? Is that saying something?



"Attacked"?? Come on Robert, you have posted on here for a while now and in all that time you have not held back on your opinion. There is nothing whatsoever wrong with that (in fact without peoples opinions the forum would be useless) and I indeed already said that your posts are generally reasoned (can't remember my exact words). But the first time someone decides to question or contradict your opinion you react like this? Smacks of 'throwing the toys out of the pram'.

You have a valid opinion Robert, but so do I and everyone else, and we're all allowed to express it as long as it's not offensive or impolite surely? A forum is about debate not simply statements of opinion.

I actually believe you're far bigger than that, and that generally you contribute well to the forum, and thus I hope you will continue to do so.

Regarding the handbrake issue; Depends a lot on the terrain. Robbert's comment brough back a memory of scary moment;
When my boy was about 4 he was cycling without problems in Holland. Then we loaded up and went to France for a holliday. He went down the first hill he ever saw, on a gravel road. Accelerated, his feet came off the pedals, handbrake didn't work, he couldn't stop anymore. It ended in a mighty crash and many tears. I felt very stupid and very lucky he escaped with cuts and bruises. Brakes need to work. Cheers JJW

Gents, as someone who has lived in the digital world all of his working life (but not gained the salary of Neo or his acting alter-ego) I think it is an opportune moment to introduce a little parable we worked out some time back for the use of email with our customers.

Email - a limited and miserable tool intended to convey information between _different_ people. It uses (the english) language which is imprecise at the best of times as no two people comprehend it the same way. As it removes audible and visual queues it only contains the least valuable 33% of the true information at best. Email does not create the friends you want to keep. If anything is going south in email then it should not be on email.

I think TalkMorgan is as popular because of the effort you all make when you arrange the meetings. Which rather highlights my failure for not making one yet, sorry.

From my limited previous experience of both of you I would suspect you both had some decoration underway had you been ladies (see how we can cause grief with just a tiny comment in email )

btw, I am at the stage where I vote for "none of the above" w.r.t. TG. The new series on TV is turning out to be the most self-indulgent one yet IMHO. I stopped reading the magazine some time back as it was becoming more like CC with every issue.

Fair point in that respect. My plot, and thus pedal car/bicycle track is level and as such not a big deal in my case. Valid point though.

I re-emphasise however this was not my (original) argument

What are you trying to say, nay saying? I'm pre-menstrual?



I also like your email definition, very true. Howeve, and to quote, "when things start to go South, it shouldn't be on email" whilst very true fails here as I have no other method of communication with Robert and I wanted to add 'balance' (my own version/opinion of course) to his opinion in open forum.

I have no axe to grind (on this matter anyway ) and could/can/will still 'communicate' with Robert jovially and (hopefully) sensibly. He has an opinion and stated it, I had an opposing opinion and stated as much. I may even disagree with him again, but as stated surely as long as its not offensive or rude, then its ok? No-one died, nor even got badly wounded did they it would be a shame for him to leave because of that?

Right, I'll go back and hide under my rock until this period passes (see what I did there )
and a to either of you when we meet

This is my litmus test for whether I need to wade in or not; thankfully, I have only had to do this once on Talk Morgan in nearly 5-years. I'd say this makes this site not only a very pleasant place to spend time but also says far more about the quality of the members.

When discussions involve a subject people are passionate about, there will always be disagreements. Hence, the reason some sites ban the discussion of politics and religion; although, again, I do not view censorship as the way forward and put the faith, and onus, onto the members to discuss these topics in a manner that shows respect for other opinions and never allows disagreement to become personal.

I don't believe I need to say more, other than I truly feel that open discussion of all Morgan models and every aspect of the buying process, ownership and sale of them is essential to the enthusiasts community and the company itself. For my part (and for those of Aeroman and Boshly), everything we say on this site, is also said to the directors of MMC (for the most part face to face) - we voice both praise and when we see room for improvement, this is also relayed.

I do not see a golden halo around the company, nor do I view the product through rose tinted spectacles; however, I have taken the time to get to know the people behind the cars and while they, like the product, isn't always perfect, I would never question their passion, commitment or dedication to the product or the constant improvement of it.

My previous comments stand - the more you charge for a product the more demanding I believe the customer becomes (this is as true as a move from a £30k 4/4 Sport to a £50k Roadster V6 as it is for a £70k Aero 8 to a £135k SS) and therefore, a constant evaluation of quality and commitment to constant improvement is necessary to ensure commercial success.

Dangerous for me to get over involved here but Roberts' "old" Aero was being sold (now sold) by its current keeper because it is not raw enough (too good if you wish) and will be replaced by a traditional car.

To quote section 4 "Use" in the Super Sport Pedal Car Instruction book:
"Braking should be achieved by applying force in the opposite direction to normal pedalling. The handbrake should only be used when stationary and is not designed to slow the car when in motion".

Having said that, Robert should have had the car returned to him with the handbrake functioning for which I will take some responsibility.
George from RPM is now getting in touch with Robert to resolve this.