Talk Morgan Forums Morgan Sports Cars Morgan Aero 8, 2012< Plus 8, SuperSports, Coupe & Aeromax gearbox in aeromax/ supersport

In their own mind.. everyone is a driving god!!

Having driven, Cruise Auto, Sport Auto, Hydraulic Automated Manual, Regular Manual, Straight Cut Synchro Manual, Non Synchro Manual and full race Hewland f3 clutchless shift manual. (Paddle, Stick and centre shift-auto)

(Right... got all that out then!)

Each gearbox has a match to personal driving style and vehicle purpose. As one of the most important interfaces a driver has to the machine he's operating, it needs to be fit for the purpose, provide the driver the ability to obtain the best (fastest, easiest, relaxing, flexible) and most enjoyable experience.

The Aero's changing image has increasingly tended towards the auto cruiser/GT. The re-programable ZF can provide an engaging experience and is certainly quick/dynamic.

That said... and as proven by the numerous GT & F1 teams, it is hard to get away from the mechanical efficency and controlability of either a Race mechanical sequential or an automated manual. Unfortunately, these gearboxes are seriously expensive (in the region of 50k+) and require significant maintenance and in the automated manual's case, can be jerky/eat clutches (3k on Gallardo's).

Stepping away from these race bred boxes everything tends to be a compromise either in the direction of driver control (Manual) or Ease of drive (Full Auto).

Manual boxes can mimic the characteristics of race boxes subject to the limitations of synchro speed, helical gear-set and literal driver arm speed/clutch control. It is almost impossible to match the performance characteristics of true race boxes but it does one key thing.. the driver can drag gears, introduce slip, force over-run, short shift, rev-match.. infinately varying the shift pattern without relying on the brakes alone to signal to the gearbox controller. (Your brain can do this WAY, WAY faster than the gearbox controller could and funnily enough get it right very time.. Auto probably not quite)

Auto boxes on the other hand, can (at best) use trottle position, road speed, engine speed, brake position and a statistical look up table of previous events to select the shift sequence in an attempt to mimic the behaviours of a driver (give the best experience). Within these limitations the Auto box can "out-shift" a manual car as it it's shifts are exact... every time (unlike almost every driver). On the 0-60 sprint the Auto box can come up trumps, what do you think is the reason the US use Hurst Indy Auto shifters in the drag strip cars? They do however remove one of the imputs from the driver - to make things easier or compensate for a statistically likely skill defecite.

Bottom line, road cars (other than a very few which do not include any Morgan variants) have compromise boxes (Manual or Auto) which attempt to relax the driver and modestly cover the skills defecit present without exploding.

Auto's will provide more accessible performance as they reduce (remove) the information Input/Output to the driver to a managable level... well to a certain point. A well driven Manual should always be able beat an Auto balancing up the losses in Auto Vs. the clunky Human Interface/usability compropmises in the Manual management system (stick shift).

It's just that not everyone is able to, at varying quantities of frequency, achieve this, if at all. Bottom line is... it's your choice... Auto is easy to drive but ultimately limited by the Matrix style application that controls it (even with AI)... or a Manual which you can push to the limit of your driver performance or let you be lazy and do things an Auto never would.

I guess.. the Manual represents Choice and Freedom.

Driving God..? every time behind the wheel..... getting the last 10% from the car... almost never... Having been to the track sessions with Aero's, (like has been said somewhere else), Blat flat out in a straight line then super slow in the bends... So I can revise that to.. say last 20-30%?

Manual I guess means you can at least pretend
Auto, probably drives better more of the time.. but living in the Matrix.

did you see that white rabbit just then?

The auto learns somehow your driving style, but it keep a short memory. Probably the last ten minutes or so are considered and should you slow down long enough, will opt for a relax mode.

Switching off the battery when not using the car also reset the memory to standard.

Just back from Goodwood tonight, a lovely 2.200 kilometers drive on the week end and a fantatsic event!

And the auto worked perfectly

Cerealsurfer's informative note sums it up for me: either infinite variable control or finite lookup table (made somewhat flexible with learning, but nevertheless finite in options at any given time point).

Paul Frere noted that from the point of view of using the engine properly, most of us were better off with an auto box, because it will in most cases outperform the (even skilled) driver.

For everyday driving it is auto for me. For my toys, I want mechanical enjoyment so standard clutch and stick will do.

Andrew, have to agree.
Having driven Mercedes EPS trucks, (no, I know they're more like pre-selector boxes) I love to try a 5 speed sequential, manual, in RTA or 6 speed in Piggy...
Justifying the cost of changing the 4 speed Cortina box in a 34 year old Mog is somewhat more difficult (and would put me into modified if I ever decided to compete ...)
Cheers,

I find that I tend to switch the Auto into manual most of the time now. Much better having close control - it gives the benefits of a manual without a clutch. The only problem is around town that if you slow down or stop, it shifts down to first, so you don't always know which gear you are in.

+1

the only auto box that I have found to be better imho is Porsche's PDK box.

Which isn't an auto

Doppelkupplungsgetriebe or dual clutch transmission. No clutch in sight for the Morgan, just a torque converter.

There's always one pedant, isn't there!

There has been much discussion on other forums about this issue, being a simple guy if it changes gear automatically through an electronically controlled single or double clutch box or through the use of a torque converter, then it is an auto box...
Simples.

I'm simply using the technical definition.

If you'd rather rely on layman's terminology or vaguely descriptive definitions, I fear we may revert back to a time when people that the earth was flat because surely, when you look at it, it is.

(you of all people! next you'll be calling whisky Scotch!)

So we are settled then, all we need now is an internal language.

Stick = Manual
Slush = Full auto
Crunch = Hewland
Complex = motorised manual
Clicky = DSG

Any good ?