Talk Morgan Forums Morgan Sports Cars Morgan Three Wheeler & Super 3 Aquaplaning M3W's

After reading the horrible experiences from Red Three and Rolsmith I come to the conclusion that both had (relatively compared) the same front tires ( Blockley & Excelsior )

Could that be one of the causes for the aquaplaning because both having a similar profile?
And both having a completely different profile as the stock Avon’s.

I installed last week, for the first time in my M3W career, Excelsior front tires and need to admit the handling feels better, more direct and stable.

I looked to this Excelsior tires and thought: “For what reason are this little separating bulkheads in this profile ?”

If water is trapped in the profile spaces, which I marked with yellow, it can ONLY go sideways out.
Because of this little bulkheads it can’t go to the front or to the back.

If there is more water as the gap to the side can handle the tire will start aquaplaning !!

Would there be two extra possibilities the water could escape ( to the front and to the back of the lengthways profile ) there would be a chance that the tire would NOT go in aquaplaning.

Despite it are brand new tires I grab a Stanley knife and cut all this bulkheads out
(give it a small cut on both sides and with a plier you pull the little piece of rubber out).

I can’t imagine that it will makes any difference on the handling of the tire.

If if this will makes a difference on aquaplaning ? I really don’t know, but my simple brains tell me it’s worth the try.

Or did I do something stupid ?

That explanation seems very logical to me and worth a try - it can do no harm.

It has to help prevent the build up of the wall of water in front of the rolling tyre to a certain extent.

As I wrote on the other thread, I had a huge aquaplane moment on the standard Avons. Personally, I don't think it's tyre related.

Putting it in context though, I think it is just something you need to be aware of. Elise spin easily on slippy roads, superbikes can spit you off with heavy throttle and the M3W doesn't like deep puddles with one (or maybe two) wheels.

By removing the web you will get more block movement and increase the tyre temperature.

For racing this would not be good but on the road probably not enough effect to be noticed.

Keep us informed regarding the feel of the steering from the before and after web removal.

Might make a difference but I suspect not. Talking to some tyre development people way back when I was racing bikes they were fairly disparaging about tread patterns though the tread to void ratio they were very keen on. They rather suggested that the tread pattern was much more down to marketing and cosmetics than anything to do with grip or shifting water.
The early three wheelers were notorious from what I have heard and read for snapping violently sideways if you got a rear wheel puncture, it may be that rear wheel aquaplaning has a similar effect and that is the real problem but it is difficult to tell for sure. My rear tyre though still very much legal was due to be changed once I got home so was definitely past its best for standing water. In a four wheel car you will have something of a wake of shallower water for the back tyres to run in and hopefully therefore avoid them lifting off of the road not something that works in a three wheeler or not until you are distinctly sideways anyway .
I may sort out a slightly narrower tyre for the back once the repairs are done, I don't think the slight loss of dry grip will matter at all as the fronts are understeering with huge slip angles long before the rear is losing grip and even in the normal (non-aquaplaning) wet I find it is much the same arrangement. Any slight improvement in aquaplaning performance will probably be more in the head than on the road, but it might still be an improvement.

Interesting post. Please keep the updates coming Good Sir

I suspect the aquaplaning begins always with the rear tyre. The front is heavy and its tyres are skinny, while the rear is light and the tyre is fat.

The way I see this, if you are travelling with lots of water on the tarmac at some point the rear will be always on the verge of going above water and not slicing it. You might not even notice it too much if you are going in a motorway and therefore with minimal side movement, because your front tyres are doing all the hard work of keeping the car in contact with the road surface.

(do remember, with the M3W and unlike it happens with cars or even bikes, the rear tyre doesn't follow the already cleared path of the front tyre so, in a way, they ALL work as front tyres)

So, with a rear tyre barely coping, you only need a puddle under ONE of the front tyres to make it all go wrong. Ir may even be that the front tyre doesn't do any aquaplaning, but if one of the front tyres gets more resistance to forward movement than the other front tyre and if you couple that with a rear tyre barely touching the tarmac ... you're toast in a millisecond and you didn't even saw it coming.

That sounds logical to me Mario.

Yes Mario has summed it up succinctly , with the added issue of the front wheels wakes probably feeding large amounts towards the rear wheel, watch a catamaran hulled ferry coming straight at you and you will get the picture, the bridge decks on such craft have to be strengthened or shaped to allow for this high velocity flow.

+1
Yep, I'll run with that...