In my perception, the 996 used to be the ugly duckling among the 911s. Today, this perception has changed dramatically. I like the 996 more and more. The last Porsche with sleek lines. I used to dislike the headlights, but today I find them retro-modern and very cool. Last summer I came across a 996 in silver and at first I had this wow feeling, what was that, until I could identify it in the rear-view mirror. That had never happened to me before with a 996. As far as the engines were concerned, they were a weak point according to popular opinion. Porsche simply took the 993 engine and planted a water-cooled head on it. It didn't work well. Apart from those engine failures where even in the car park the valves could be destroyed at idle. If you're interested in a 996, the turbo engines are considered very reliable and highly desirable.
Well if you are buying it from an official porker centre then get the official porker warranty and live on the sticky bit of the envelope! Lets face it people in (Morgan) glass houses need to find sponge stones.
Everyone loves a Morgan. Even me, unless it's broken again.
There must be an element of truth in the bore scoring scaremongering but I still think how you use the engine can make the difference. I had the 996 and a Boxster of the same era, the same goes for the Kseries Elise I had which also had a bad reputation,, the cooling is remote from the engine and careful heat management is the key. Sustained use of full power is fine but you needed to bring it up to temperature gently and even more importantly cool it down the same way. I do that with all engines and I never once worried about any of the well publicised problems of either of those cars. At the time, I needed the back seat of the 996 but the Boxster was the better car, the Elise was far more exciting than both and the Ferrari is really just a property built Elise. It does have too much power but once you’ve got used to enough power the excitement comes from having more than you’ve capable of applying. The 996 design is ageing well now, it’s gone beyond the sad, unfashionable stage and the tidy ones are really looking good, particularly the most basic models, it’s such a pure shape.
I don't think it's scaremongering but bore scoring is only one of the elements that affect Porsche engines of that generation. The most concerning is IMS bearing failure which resulted in legal action being brought against Porsche in the USA.
Here's a summary of the IMS bearing problem, many others are available.
And here's a summary of the potential engine problems that can beset that generation of engine. Hartech are highly respected Porsche engine specialists and have done a lot of research into these problems.
There are 2 Porsches that would be top of my list, a late 993 Turbo S Cabriolet a good one are as rare as hen's teeth and a 997.2 Turbo S Cabriolet for slightly less money, a great look to the car and more than fast enough for most people. All the engine issues disappear with the much cleaner modified engine on the 997.2 model. A neighbour down the road has the 997.2 turbo cabriolet, had it from new, the wife potters around in it doing the shopping etc, hardly gets the engine warm and every year they go and stretch its legs on a continental tour/blast.
When he takes it in for a service, he mulls over getting a new Porsche, but he hangs onto this one, the local dealer just can't get him to swop, its now done over 60k absolutely trouble free miles. with just regular routine servicing.
The 996 has never aesthetically been pleasing for me, I prefer the raised headlights of previous and more recent Porsches, it seems more in keeping with the 911 model silhouette.
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IThe intermediate shaft issue is rarer than people believe, also bore scraping, BUT you are right, it depends how fastidious the owner was. All academic now as I didn't win the lottery....!!
Peter, 66, 2016 Porsche Boxster S No longer driving Tarka, the 2014 Plus 8...
There must be an element of truth in the bore scoring scaremongering but I still think how you use the engine can make the difference. I had the 996 and a Boxster of the same era, the same goes for the Kseries Elise I had which also had a bad reputation,, the cooling is remote from the engine and careful heat management is the key. Sustained use of full power is fine but you needed to bring it up to temperature gently and even more importantly cool it down the same way. I do that with all engines and I never once worried about any of the well publicised problems of either of those cars. At the time, I needed the back seat of the 996 but the Boxster was the better car, the Elise was far more exciting than both and the Ferrari is really just a property built Elise. It does have too much power but once you’ve got used to enough power the excitement comes from having more than you’ve capable of applying. The 996 design is ageing well now, it’s gone beyond the sad, unfashionable stage and the tidy ones are really looking good, particularly the most basic models, it’s such a pure shape.
Your experience mirrors mine except that I only ever tried the Porkers, several times, when thinking of selling the Elise. The latter was totally reliable thanks to a Toyota engine - I avoided the Rover ones because the K series head problems were very well known in all the cars the engine was used in whether front or rear. So were the intermediate shaft and bore scoring of the vanilla (ie non Metzger) 996 and 997.1. But try as I may I found something missing in the Porkers, particularly the Boxter and I did really want to like them as a much more sensible buy than the Ferrari. It could be that they were so free of quirks as to be a bit boring and certainly the interiors were DIN standard German, very similar to the BMW and Mercs that I had. But thats a personal view and the numbers you see on the roads suggest many other would not agree.
Your description of the Ferrari as a well built Elise is debateable for me since my Elise was and still is the most reliable car that I have owned over 7 years. But in design terms you are right which is flattering to Ferrari IMHO. The Elise is undoubtedly the pinnacle of British sports car making.
I suspect it may be no great secret that seldom used machinery can suffer somewhat..? I can remember reading of stories of huge mileages achieved on particular marques, thinking Volvo as perhaps one example..?
Having been around Morgan forums and others over a number of decades, it seems rather obvious that classics as well as modern and somewhat expensive sports cars, may exist to some degree as treasured possessions, and as such may be rarely used, often perhaps for months at a time, a situation that seems unlikely to have been high on the list of priorities in the initial design processes..? Iy seems forums tend to attract rather a lot of traffic on flat batteries, stuck clutches, corroded brake discs/drums, and seized components usually at the beginning of warmer weather in any one year. Other considerations might be that when parked up with a hot engine, followed by perhaps a few months of oil drain down time, initial fire up after resting can take a while to build oil pressure, perhaps accompanied by various rattles as the oil pump works to re-circulate the oil around rattling areas to provide them with lubrication once again..? It seems unlikely that the aforementioned issues might combine together to show up on a regularly used machine as they might on a machine being wakened after slumber...?
I suspect when mileage is taken into account in terms of the distance travelled relative to time, in terms of the age of the machine. i.e. It seems possible that a 20 year old regularly used (in the manner Ewan suggests) and well maintained classic with 100k miles on the clock, might be found to be in far better condition than a 5 year old similar example of the same marque with a mere 4k miles covered...?
I also suspect in the case of modern sports cars that might be rarely used may be bought as track day specials, or bought as being a release from general day to day pressures and used for a quick Sunday morning blast to blow the cobwebs away, and perhaps not given time to warm the engine through before giving it the beans...? There are others who may rarely use their machinery due to financial pressures, whether bought as an investment or otherwise. It seems such is the world of car finance that some marques will attract multiple ownership in a relatively short period of time, thus the old ideals vehicle assessment in terms of minimal owners and low mileage may no longer be the wisest datum on which to base purchase decisions, but then old habits/teachings die hard do they not....?
Peter, I suspect the IMS bearing shaft is the issue that may be the one possibility that scares many of the owners/buyers of 996- 997.1 buyers as I have read elsewhere that IMS failure seemingly has the potential to convert an engine to scrap value only, even at car park speeds, and without prior warning and very few miles on the clock covered..?
In terms of the Porsche models mentioned, I think it best to factor in a possible expenditure of circa £15k to the purchase evaluation of even a low mileage one owner a Porsche as possible insurance, to have the potential engine issues engineered out to some degree by the Porsche specialist mentioned by MPH, and not an OPC. I paid out £3k+ to buy into a Porsche extended warranty for a 991...! With that in mind I can well understand the idea that there will be many out there who may think that a 996-997.1 may be a future classic that may rise in appreciation/value with the passage of time and be worth spending a bit extra on an engine rebuild, perhaps more so if it seems to be using oil, or may be a tad smoky on occasion, but then IF or when the time comes to sell, I suspect that most potential purchasers may have done a bit of research on the marque and model, and....?
Heinz, as for the headlights... Hmm..? There are those who like to promote that the fried egg style is similar to that of the Porsche GT1 LeMans racer...I guess it is a mindset kinda thing...?
John, I dislike to be the one to dampen your ardour re the 997.2 on...(-: It seems Porsche may not be alone in reports of possible intake manifold fouling on Direct Fuel Injection (DFI) engines as the sludge from the crankcase and other areas of the engine is fed back into the intake in the DFI engines to cut down on emission readings, as the intake manifold does not have the benefit of regular petrol washing, as do indirect, single point injection, or carb fed engines have..? Lots to be read with a bit if interweb searching, blasting with the shells of nuts seems to be one option... Nuts or what...? (-:
Howard and those with Ferrari interests, If you have read this far... (-: The chap who`s vid I linked to a couple of days back re the maintenance of his Ferrari, has posted yet another vid, this one seemingly bolstering my thinking that Ferrari is just that bit more special than Porsche as a brand..?
John, I dislike to be the one to dampen your ardour re the 997.2 on...(-: It seems Porsche may not be alone in reports of possible intake manifold fouling on Direct Fuel Injection (DFI) engines as the sludge from the crankcase and other areas of the engine is fed back into the intake in the DFI engines to cut down on emission readings, as the intake manifold does not have the benefit of regular petrol washing, as do indirect, single point injection, or carb fed engines have..? Lots to be read with a bit if interweb searching, blasting with the shells of nuts seems to be one option... Nuts or what...? (-:
Thanks for that, I'm not surprised as most modern DFI clean burn engines seem to sludge up. The wife's diesel SLK is renown for problems with the DPF especially if used for short journeys, but if driven appropriately and a regular DPF cleaner added to the fuel, so far we have no problems. The only strange thing is that it supposed to go thru the DPF cleaner cycle during a sustained high speed journey, ours even does it on a short local run once the DPF gets upto 40% full. I can always tell when its on a DPF cleanup cycle as you can smell the acrid burnt fumes from the exhaust and the fans are running on for sometime after switching off the engine, when putting away in the garage.
Looks like it will have to be the 993 then.........must admit I'm struggling to find a replacement car for the SLC I sold....just love the wife's diesel. I've been looking at Plus 4's recently as I seem to be getting a money burning a hole in my pocket syndrome, just hope my back is upto the slightly better lower seating arrangement of the 2 seaters.....time will tell.
Last edited by JohnHarris; 03/12/2303:56 PM.
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If you want to see a beautiful 993, in fact, not unlike an old version of George’s 997, watch Beckham on Netflix, he had one and it features several times. I can’t believe I’ve said it, I’ve no interest in football and especially not English football but I’ve always thought Beckham was a decent guy. I respect him more now having watched the series, but I’ve even less respect for the football culture in England, disgraceful behaviour and not only from the nutcases.
