Talk Morgan Forums Morgan Sports Cars Morgan Three Wheeler & Super 3 CO2=3.84 g/km ?Car Tax in the UK

According to http://www.mogwire.com/ today:
"The first M3W was successfully UK road registered and passed the UK governmental requirements"

I now want an official confirmation from Morgan...

Do you know what the law is on front number plates for Trikes is Martyn, do we have to fit one on the new M3W?

for me very simple:
or: NO WAY
(I hardly drove my roadsterV6 with front nr-plate
once almost forgot to put it back on when entering the EuroChunnel)

willing to pay the fines, because: have you seen the beauty of a Belgian nr-plate?????

This is one of those, "I thought I did" moments!

My answer would have been, "yes, you do need one in the UK". My understanding was that only motorbike derived three wheelers - ie with a single front wheel for the most part are exempt from a front number-plate.

One does see Grinnal Scorpions without a front number-plate but I assume they are stretching the 'motorbike derived' designation to the limit.

I won't say never, as things fall off all the time but I've not seen any classic Morgan three wheelers without a front numberplate in the UK.

But - I have seen a few shots on new Morgan three wheelers without one, and been told second hand that Morgans were saying one was not needed. But that was second hand, and could be like their apparent 'understanding' of the convoluted weight regulations

I'm told in the UK lack of a front numberplate where one is needed is a £30 fine and no points. Probably why some Ferraris have no front numberplate, their owners can afford repeated fines (note though, if is a 'personalised plate' DVLA might take it back...).

Still think you need one really, but there are some doubts.

Will the M3W need a front number plate?
The answer seems to depend on whether the law thinks it has a body that is car-like. If it looks like a car then it needs a front NP, if it doesn't look like a car then it must not carry a front NP, unless it was made before 1st September 2001, in which case it may have a front NP if it likes. This means that the pre-war original M3Ws, which once upon a time had to have a front NP under English law, have not needed one since 2001, but can carry on showing one if they wish.
I think the current law is The Road Vehicles (Display of Registration Marks) Regulations 2001. For the purposes of these regs the M3W is defined as a motor tricycle:
http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2001/561/regulation/2/made
Section 2 (1) says a motor tricycle means a vehicle having 3 wheels symmetrically arranged.
For a motor tricycle, section6 (5) of the regs says:

(5) In the case of a motor cycle or a motor tricycle which does not have a body of a type which is characteristic of the body of a four-wheeled vehicle—

(a)a registration plate must not be fixed on the front of a vehicle if it was first registered on or after 1st September 2001, .
(b)a plate need not be fixed on the front of the vehicle if it was first registered before 1st September 2001.

So, if the M3W looks like a car, these regs do not apply, but if it does not have a car-type body then the regs must apply.
In my view, the M3W does not have a car-type body because it has received (last Friday) type approval for the road without meeting the rules required for a car: it has exposed exhausts, a pedestrian-unfriendly exposed engine at the front and so on... The registering authorities must have assessed it as a vehicle which does not have a car-type body. Therefore, it seems to me that if we put front number plates on our new M3Ws we will be in breach of Section 6 (5) of the Road Vehicles (Display of Registration Marks) Regulations 2001.

Clear as mud?
Any other views out there?

Notlob

Looked at regulations and they are badly written but my take is:
In the case of a motor cycle or a motor tricycle which does not have a body of a type which is characteristic of the body of a four-wheeled vehicle

will not cause the courts to have the same view as you. This says, 'characteristic' not compliant, and my take on the body style is a body that has twin front headlamps and parallel seating is 'car like'.

You may get away with not having one for a while, but I think the MOT inspector could well fail it for not having one.

It would be neat if, instead of a license plate, one could attach a tube across - like a continuation of the longitudinal tubes, but with a small rise to it (5cm?). It could be used to attach a bash plate to, or even those badges some people like.

I agree, it all hangs on how we interpret that pesky phrase
"a body of a type which is characteristic of the body of a four-wheeled vehicle"
If the law interprets it one way we get fined for having a front number plate, but interpret it the other way and we get fined for not having one!
Sounds like we had better wait for the MMC to issue a ruling based on sound legal advice that we can hope they will have taken and that can form a safe harbour for us when we get stopped by plod!


notlob

I've sent an email to MMC as mine should be being registered by them this week, asking what thier official view is on a front number plate.

Hopefully I'll get a prompt reply...

Ya reeli goona put a plate on ya nooooze?