Talk Morgan Forums Community Vehicle Talk (non-Morgan) Another Ship on Fire

Also my thoughts!

Next Problem for me: I need a car that allows me to tow my trailer...

There is not one that will tow 3.5T - yet.

When we had a u3a visit to Intelligent Energy (A Loughborough University spinout), the people there said that they thought the market would polarise:

Shopping trollies etc and local delivery vans = Battery
Large Goods Vehicles, big SUV's and luxury cars = Hydrogen Fuel Cell

But then they would say that as they make fuel cells. They were prohibited from telling us which manufacturers they were already working with.

Batteries are bombs in disguise because a battery contains a lot of combustable and reactive material as the electrodes are submerged in a liquid called an electrolyte, which allows for the movement of ions and consists of lithium salt and organic solvents. There is about 12kg of highly flammable lithium in a 75kwh battery and 9 Litres of solvent based electrolyte: It is these organic solvents which are the leading fire hazard in Li-ion batteries. Furthermore, the positively charged electrode (cathode) in the battery contains oxygen, which may be released if the battery is subjected to specific stresses, e.g., internal short, excessive heat, and more. This means that the Li-ion batteries have all the elements needed to self-sustain a fire.

In a powerful thermal incident, the Li-ion battery may release some of the flammable electrolyte along with various flammable/toxic gases such as hydrogen (H2), methane (CH4), carbon monoxide (CO) and hydrofluoric acid (HF). The amount and rate of the gas released depend on different parameters that are related to battery chemistry and the amount of electrical energy stored. A release of these flammable gases is what can cause fires and explosions.

As has been said the best thing to do with a burning battery is to retire and watch from. a safe distance.....

Peter, does it mean that an uncharged Li-ion battery is safer when shipped?

Hillclimbs are undoubtedly the easiest form of motorsport for EV to break into ... short bursts and favouring 'quickness' ... there's still no comp classes run due to the problems of organising safety from HV electricity and uncontrollable fire .... an ice car alight can be suppressed in seconds ... an EV can't ... and the requirement to monitor the wreck in situ for extended periods against re-ignition means an entire day's racing can be lost to a simple shunt.

The Jag team did bring their Formula-e racer to Shelsley Walsh .... setting aside it wasn't quick and underwhelming as a spectacle (their pro driver in it was slower than me in my seventies driving a home built 1100cc bitsa of a single-seater) they ran because they brought their own Safety Crew with them from the international Formula-e circus ... not an option open to us mere mortals.

As the boat in question was well alight I guess we have to assume one self-immolating EV has taken 3000 innocent ICE cars with it !☹️

K

There were 3783 cars on board, from which 498 were EV's, BMW's and MB's. Those are the facts. It is also a tragedy with one dead soul. I have no negative feelings against EV's, driving a BMW EV myself for more thans 2 years now and 5 years of Tesla driving before that. I agree it is a big concern and I do hope safer and more sustainable Solid State batteries will come for reasonably prices. We have to do something because our planet is in danger!

Ys Ruut we do. I guess some of us feel there are other routes with less upfront carbon costs but the UK govt at least is forcing a route with EV where the charging infrastructure nor the generation power exists. Making existing ICE more carbonneutral is possible by green fuel.

We’re also trying to improve air quality in urban areas.

Agreed & there are bolt ons for that & schemes to ban polluting cars. All I am saying is we need a mix to bridge the gap. Also trucks etc need hydrogen technolgy as do boilers. It isn't one size fits all & a rapid switch overs bins already used carbon for for new so the result is worse.

Most the cars seem to have a skateboard battery layout so it is covering the bottom face of the vehicle. Road debris hitting the underside of the vehicle remains a worry to me. I guess they have calculate a metal barrier strength but it remains a worry where it is a shar metal object flicked from the car in front or lorry to the side. Another risk is due to the weight of the vehicle. I am just waiting for a 2-3 ton BEV/PHEV to go green laneing, miss a corner and strike the underside of the vehicle. Is the design braced for someone beaching the chassis.

Should we all start carrying long sticks and marshmallows, sausages and chilled beer/wine in anticipation of a good bbq being more common on our travels ?