Talk Morgan Forums Morgan Sports Cars Maintenance & Servicing Splined shaft lubrication

Hi Paul. I took a look at Wheel Mania’s web site and Morgan are not listed. I will call them and have a chat. Not see Matt Armstrong’s video’s yet but will look up. I think that a conversion to alloy wheels is the only sensible solution, albeit yet another large Morgan related expense.

I have no experience of wire wheels, other than that which I have read over the years on Morgan forums. I have owned a 60`s Lotus Elan with steel knock ons which were cracked due to some measure of excessive tightening made obvious by the obvious damage to it`s spinners.. The old thing lost drive one day as the result of shedding it`s last peg, pegs being used to transmit drive from a plate on the drive shaft that protruded through into the steel wheel... That little ex-race car taught me a lot about mechanical design and failure... (-:

I use nothing much more than logic to think that any play between splined drive shaft and the splines in the hub of a wire wheel is a substantial mechanical flaw, and more so if a clunk may be heard or worse still felt when changing direction of drive.. i.e. fwd to rev, or vice versa..?
It would seem any such clunk may be transferring a metal to metal hammering action that will pass a degree of shock all the way from the wheel hub through to the entire length of the drive system where hopefully the springs in the clutch driven plate halt it`s travel on and into the engine...?
I have read in past times of the splines in the driveshaft and or hub instead of being castellated with flat tops end up with sharp edged peaks due to the hammer action being ignored..

I know not whether the splines on Morgan wheels are parallel or tapered, if parallel then applying more pressure than required to retain the wheel into the mating of hub to shaft would seem likely to cause damage to both the spinner it`s self and it`s seating in the wheel..?

As for grease on the splines, I suspect it`s primary advantage is to reduce the chance of corrosion build up which could cause issues if/when one requires to remove a wheel that has siezed on due to corroded splines..?

Just thinking in type, more than happy to be corrected...

Tapered. Morgans use 42mm (Type 42) hubs and wheels to match, measured across the outside of the splines. Alloy centre-locks have been used in non- wire wheel versions on Aeros and Plus 8s they caused sadness as explained earlier.
I have never heard of a over torqued tapered wire wheel..but I guess it can happen. When torquing to Enzo's recommended figure, it would be hard for an owner to get higher.


Agreed. A good correction is the most common way to learn for me now. Learning at our age is certainly more important than gotcha.

Lorne

Gomog, thanks for the heads up on the drive splines being tapered, which seems a better design than parallel splines, with the chance that perhaps spline wear could in time be compensated for, assuming there was no stop built in to the wheel hub to drive shaft fit, other than being limited by the spacer.

I had not taken time to read through the thread but was attracted to respond by the comment on a knock being heard/felt as drive was initially taken up, perhaps more so when changing fwd/rev direction of travel.. Any such knock being an initial warning that there is a possible issue developing and in need of resolution, and ideally some understanding as to how it came about..

As for over-torquing wheel spinners.... Hmm.. ? I suspect had you seen the the state of the dog eared spinners on my old Lotus wheels you might think a bit of excessive force had been applied...The 4lb mash hammer in the boot and the cracks in the steel wheels when I bought the Elan, kinda hinted that there might be problems ahead... ? (-:

As for learning at our age...Hmm..? Trying to remember that which I have learned, is more the issue now... Shrug.

George. YOU may still call me Lorne.

Yes as I mentioned. I began my Morgan existence going through by going through sets of battered spinners at a rate of a set every 18 months. And this after I missed and broke a wheel wire using the 5-sided thingies and their short adapter. Tim Waller, ex-AutoX, ex-eMog ex- et al, turned me on to Ferrari, the fella who made wire wheel and centre locks famous. I believe you were there at the time. Wire wheel only became the iconic gorgeous (and frustrating) British thing after that. Waller has many old Morgans (5 shown on the Morgan Registry) and an old Ferrari as well among other cars he works on. When he mentioned the Enzo torque to me, I was shocked. But research showed he was right! He found the breaker bar adapter fabricator (3 ears only) for me 25 years ago and I have used it and nary a problem with centre-locks since. I am pleased there are so many variants on that theme now.

The sad thing about tapered spines is by the time we realize what has happened, both hubs and wheels are shot. Now that is expensive..wheels AND hubs! Happily I had figured out the centre-locks and non-damaging torque BEFORE my first Morgan melted and the all-stainless test set the MMC sent me (bless'em) solved the other issue of rust. After that I merely need to learn how to tune wire wheels hem, which musically speaking is easy for any of us who grew up with 60s music!

Wire wheels were originally adopted by Enzo, because they were lighter than steel in the pre-alloy era. They are also drop dead gorgeous, thougha first class PIA. Even today, alloy wire wheels are the lightest of all.Of course, the centre lock system is silly for a road going car. I do not need Formula 1 speed to remove road going wheels any more than we need oil coolers or racing roll bars when we don't race. But hey, why not play the part?!

Lorne (sometimes called GoMoG)

P.S.I prefer Lorne