Talk Morgan Forums Morgan Sports Cars Maintenance & Servicing Part number for sump plug seal

Hopefully a hands on owner of a 70th will come along to assist in identifying..

Geoff, if you are an MSCC member this is just the sort of thing they should know.

A lesser man would have sucked the contents out / flushed and sucked out again by now and not done it properly.

Good luck

Regards
Richard

Hi Geof

I have a 1.8 Ford Zetec in my Morgan and the official torque spec according to a Haynes manual I have for the sump plug for that engine is 25Nm which is around 18.4lbft. It does not seem tight enough, but like you I resit the temptation to tighten further. To put my mind at rest I put a dab of security check paint (see below) across the junction of the plug head and sump. Its like a thick nail varnish and in fact you probably could use nail varnish. I can inspect the paint very easily with the car on the ground by just glancing underneath with a torch.

Regards Tony

Not "both" . The stats say 41,233 last month. And gorup, I do not know either of these gentlemen...not a clue. I am sorry if I have offended them. One of them posts more than all others on this forum.
Happily they assure us they are ignoring me.

My fiercest loyalty is to Morgan owners. The most important key here is not now a leaking plug or bile . After all, I noted a leaking sump will cause no harm to the car or its the owner, only frustration and a filthy engine bay. I have seen a lot of filthy engine bays. We all have The problem now is aluminum sumps on a Plus 8s. That is a problem a Roadster store owner can warn you about. SALMO sump is aluminum. From what I can see (the image galery link does not work for me) seem a crude homemade aluminum box made of sheet aluminum. I would not have a clue what its sump plug is any more than I care know the sump plugs on the LR cast sumps the MMC refused to use . The Roadster crowd will tell you that cast is fragile and a homemade sheet nt much better. An aluminum sump is a risk at speed, and they aren't destroyed at anything but speed..just like the original Roadster sumps were. Some Roadster owners here here became so worried about that they actually lowered their ground clearance in an attempt for protection. Thank goodness dear Peter Mulberry, a dearly missed angel, tried his best.

Here are places to buy the alternative Plus 8 sump suggested

https://www.ebay.com/itm/255259812508
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/135063388018?itmmeta=01KR51WB4RGKN5SMHMVH4JZ8AM&hash=item1f7267bf72 (merely wire brush it clean and repaint and it will be just as good)
https://www.johncraddockltd.co.uk/e...classic-discovery-1-90110-and-101fc.html
https://www.mulfab.co.uk/products/rover-v8-sumps/
https://rimmerbros.com/Item--i-ERR4633
https://www.roversnorth.com/parts/err4633_oil_sump_v8_3_5_3_9_4_0l

Regardless of the price you pay they are worth it. Thicker gauge steel so much so they can be used as a safe jacking point, unneeded but good to know More clearance, more oil capacity. Don't wait for sadness to occur. Act before. This applies only to those without a steel Rover Plus 8 sump.

Lorne

P.S.Those effected can use the removed homemade homemade sump as a punch bowl.

Oh yes you do know me - here for everyone to digest are your true feelings about TM and Dave W in particular from your own electronic quill - I rest my case.

gomog the reality of denial...

The link doesn't work Rich.

Thanks Keith - it is a chain of PM’s so probably won’t work then.

I’m gazing at Concorde in Filton at the moment but rest assured I shall address that when I get home tonight as TM’ers need to know how evil and jealous of TM he is.

The essentials of the PM from Lorne a few years back - the rest is intact and saved for a rainy day..


It can all be worked out using only logic. For almost three decades, eMog/GoMoG have never sought made any revenue or even allowed advertising in any form..even google. Even the famous eMog badge
was sold at cost. So the costs have been borne by me, enough now to buy many Morgans. But I don't regret that at all..despite the livid pressure from my wife and others..especially when what I have done for
free becomes a sad target. But I reap a deep pleasure helping people. I found it infinitely frustrating to own a Morgan pre-GoMoG.I actually started it for an audience of one..me. as a mogging aid rather than
stuffing papers under the seats of the car. When two Morgan friends saw it, they begged me to make it public. I did, with a LOT of shyness. Now I get pilliared regularly on TM. (wryly) You would think, with its
widely proclaimed utility, the smart thing would be to try to ensure its continuity rather than panning it.

So what malice or self-interest on earth can one attribute to me? Doesn't make sense. Like this latest thread. What do I care about whether I am politically correct about who forums represent. It is added as a
service to others. And frankly, from what insiders have told me (some very bitterly) TalkMorgan controls the MSCC (or whatever is left of it.

But I have always found the Morgan community is the presages the anglo world. I can't figure that out, but there you have it. (IMHO) As the Morgan community amd MMC changed, so did the anglo-world.
Internet-wise it went from a lovely warm and fuzzy social discovery to gratuitously vicious. Who would have thought that it would give a high podium to the less pleasant examples of humanity, which
I still feel are rarer that the large, sadly silent, mass of normal people. But the curious thing about the huge majority is, unlike the haters, they shrink from confrontation or comment, leaving them majority helpless.

You are different. You speak up. That makes you even rarer than the cretins!!!

Quote
The claim of TM is that they have never banned anyone,


That is sadly (and absolutely) not true..though admittedly, I have not tracked regularly TM for many years. I consult it when someone asks me to help them with a problem they have unsuccessfully posted there or, stupidly,
when someone warns me they are attacking again. They have banned many people..altered their messages or worse. It has nothing to do with the Terms & Conditions. It happens when these messages were
posted as warnings against discovered faults or even danger from errant advice given. For example, when their recommended method of redoing a Morgan front suspension (by Dave W) put a Frenchmen in the
hospital with missing teeth and a crushed cheek bone, they refused to accept a post explaining why their method was dangerous and offering safe options from dealers and gurus. There is a long list of such things.
Now you see why I dislike guruism.

Quote
Keep your site going, I advise most new owners to acquaint themselves with it as do a couple of other hands on TMers.


I am working on ways to set it up to have it exist after I am gone. But, not to worry, I have never fretted or cared much about the size of its traffic..aside from being astounded by it.

Good to have this exchange. Take heed. The GoMoG archives and contacts are much larger than what is displayed on the net. If you need help with something, keep me in mind.

Lorne

Below the red line is a copy and paste from his PM, just to make that absolutely clear.

He removed himself from the message within days, hoping it would vanish I imagine.

What are you referring to +8Rich? Dates? Context? I am completely at sea. Still no idea who you or "Graham" are?

Are you well? So many of us, including me, are aging. That does not always happens with grace.

I am investigated options to that homemade aluminum sump. Those with them should be offered options as the Roadster crowd were. Can someone send me a picture of it?
lg@gomog,com I cannot access it

L.

Who would have thought copper crush washers could be so interesting!

The aluminium 14.5mm ID ALU1403L washer is probably best used with an aluminium sump if you have concerns about galvanic corrosion.

The 16mm ID 213961 washer seems to be used for the 3.5lit Rover V8. You can also use 213961L or 213961A which is labeled a crush washer. These are all the same size and, not surprisingly, all look the same. However, they can also be 20/21mm ID!

Then we have ETC 7398 which is also 20/21 mm ID and seems to be associated with the petrol injection 3.9lit engines.

Confused? As far as part numbers are concerned it's a bit of a mess.

I think the answer is to make sure you have the same ID washer to hand as the one you took off, whatever the part number.

On the other hand RichardV6 probably has the best idea of buying a selection box.

To be on the safe side I've bought two ETC 7398 and a selection box. This should last me well past the time when I've forgotten I even owned a car!

Yes. The mechanic art form can get pretty picky! (aka anal)

For example, what you are buying and Richard's posted set are not, per se, crush washers. They are merely plain copper washers. They are designed differently. I use them for spacers, for which they are ideal.

Here is what google says verbatim to a question of "crush copper washers versus copper washers".

"Copper [b]crush washers are designed to plastically deform (aka squish) under pressure to create a
high-integrity, leak-proof seal for, say, oil drains or high-pressure lines. Standard, solid flat copper washers serve
primarily as spacers or static, low-pressure seals, merely distributing load rather than deforming to fill gaps" [/b]

This little bit reflects my experience with the sump you and I use. Rimmer and other specialist sell crush washers specifically for your Morgan under their part number 213961a which replaced the original 21396, one of the original numbers for the correct washer . https://rimmerbros.com/Item--i-213961A However, as the French say, "Chacun à son goût". And little leaking at the sump plug is something that can be tolerated by most people 'cept the odd nutter like me and Concours players. Manufacturers, change these little thingies as costs change. https://www.macrotrends.net/1476/copper-prices-historical-chart-data Economists call it "hidden inflation".. namely holding the product price steady but degrading product quality It has become the most common expression of inflation for the last few decades. Manufacturers know that inflation is politically unpopular and have adjusted accordingly. Rimmer also sells plain copper washers. I show both types below. The difference, in layman's language, is that the plain copper washer, in this usage, will not deform as much to compensate as much for anomalies specific to your sump and plug.

Lorne